Talk:List of references to religion in the Halo series: Difference between revisions

m
Text replacement - "haloalpha" to "halowikia"
m (Text replacement - "haloalpha" to "halowikia")
 
(12 intermediate revisions by 7 users not shown)
Line 2: Line 2:
Many of these references in the page could be from the Qur'an or the Torah also, I suggest we rename it to "List of Abrahamic religion references" instead of Biblical references. [[User talk:Baryon15|Baryon15]] 22:03, 29 July 2009 (UTC))
Many of these references in the page could be from the Qur'an or the Torah also, I suggest we rename it to "List of Abrahamic religion references" instead of Biblical references. [[User talk:Baryon15|Baryon15]] 22:03, 29 July 2009 (UTC))


:I've renamed the page again - "the three religions of abraham" doesn't flow well, and there's more than just the Abrahamic Religion that has been referenced - we have zen and buddhism being referenced as well, and the new title is more inclusive. -- <b>[[Halopedia:Administrators|<font color=indigo>Administrator</font>]] [[User:Specops306|<font color=indigo>Specops306</font>]] - ''[[User Talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Qur'a 'Morhek</font>]]'' <sup>''[[w:c:halofanon:Operation: HOT GATES|<u><font color=purple>Honour Light Your Way!</font></u>]]''</sup></b> 00:33, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
:I've renamed the page again - "the three religions of abraham" doesn't flow well, and there's more than just the Abrahamic Religion that has been referenced - we have zen and buddhism being referenced as well, and the new title is more inclusive. -- <b>[[Halopedia:Administrators|<font color=indigo>Administrator</font>]] [[User:Specops306|<font color=indigo>Specops306</font>]] - ''[[User Talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Qur'a 'Morhek</font>]]'' <sup>''[[halofanon:Operation: HOT GATES|<u><font color=purple>Honour Light Your Way!</font></u>]]''</sup></b> 00:33, 30 July 2009 (UTC)


==-==
==-==
Line 47: Line 47:
== Merge of Norse and Greek Pages ==
== Merge of Norse and Greek Pages ==


Honestly, I don't think those pages should be merged into this one. This page has to do more with the Bible and Torah, maybe they could be merged into a page called "Mythology". [[User:Dandarro nahan|<font color="red">'''Captain Fat Hobo Guy'''</font>]]''' <sup>[[Image:Captain Grade One.png|30px]]</sup><span style="color:green;">[[User talk:Dandarro nahan | Talk To Me]]</span>'''
Honestly, I don't think those pages should be merged into this one. This page has to do more with the Bible and Torah, maybe they could be merged into a page called "Mythology". [[User:Dandarro nahan|<font color="red">'''Captain Fat Hobo Guy'''</font>]]''' <sup>File:Captain Grade One.png|30px]]</sup><span style="color:green;">[[User talk:Dandarro nahan | Talk To Me]]</span>'''
:-They should all be on the "Mythology" page. Since they're all pretty much that.--[[User talk:Hotdamnitsaaron|Hotdamnitsaaron]] 02:57, October 26, 2009 (UTC)
:-They should all be on the "Mythology" page. Since they're all pretty much that.--[[User talk:Hotdamnitsaaron|Hotdamnitsaaron]] 02:57, October 26, 2009 (UTC)
::mythology =\= religion [[User talk:Asdf1239|Asdf1239]] 04:22, February 14, 2010 (UTC)
::mythology =\= religion [[User talk:Asdf1239|Asdf1239]] 04:22, February 14, 2010 (UTC)
Line 53: Line 53:
::::As a Norse Pagan, I would actually be in favor of merging all spiritual/religious/mythological references together. HOwever, as I said on the Norse References page, I feel that ''all'' of it - the Judeo-Christian references included - should be put under the umbrella of "Mythological References". One persons religion is another person's mythology, and it's unfair to label one as "religion" because it's popular and the other "myth" because it's a minority. We should also only put in the things that are solid and evident; none of this "Tsavo Highway ''might'' be a reference to the highway mentioned that one time in Revelation!"[[User:Ocean Soul|Ocean Soul]] ([[User talk:Ocean Soul|talk]]) 21:41, 3 November 2015 (EST)
::::As a Norse Pagan, I would actually be in favor of merging all spiritual/religious/mythological references together. HOwever, as I said on the Norse References page, I feel that ''all'' of it - the Judeo-Christian references included - should be put under the umbrella of "Mythological References". One persons religion is another person's mythology, and it's unfair to label one as "religion" because it's popular and the other "myth" because it's a minority. We should also only put in the things that are solid and evident; none of this "Tsavo Highway ''might'' be a reference to the highway mentioned that one time in Revelation!"[[User:Ocean Soul|Ocean Soul]] ([[User talk:Ocean Soul|talk]]) 21:41, 3 November 2015 (EST)


The word "myth" by definition isn't necessarily meaning something is false, only one of it's definitions indicates this. However in context of "mythology", every religion contains myths but being a myth does not mean that they are false. It's entirely possible for something to be a myth yet actually true. Also, whether something is solid or evident is fairly subjective and arguable. Tsavo Highway is in my view a perfectly acceptable entry, it isn't definite, but it does not have to be. --[[User:PrayingSeraph|PrayingSeraph]] ([[User talk:PrayingSeraph|talk]]) 13:04, 22 December 2015 (EST)
The word "myth" by definition isn't necessarily meaning something is false, only one of it's definitions indicates this. However in context of "mythology", every religion contains myths but being a myth does not mean that they are false. It's entirely possible for something to be a myth yet actually true. Also, whether something is solid or evident is fairly subjective and arguable. Tsavo Highway is in my view a perfectly acceptable entry, it isn't 100% confirmed definite, but it does not have to be. --[[User:PrayingSeraph|PrayingSeraph]] ([[User talk:PrayingSeraph|talk]]) 13:04, 22 December 2015 (EST)


==The last comment==
==The last comment==
The last part of the page says that God summoned an angel to guard the garden. Last time I read that passage, it said that God summoned several flaming guards. Which is it? Has anyone got a bible near them that they can reference? ~[[w:c:User:Blade_bane|<font color="purple">'''Know You Know,'''</font>]] ~ [[w:c:halo:Special: Contributions/Blade_bane|<font color="purple">'''That Flattery Will Get You Nowhere.'''</font>]]~ 11:00, October 26, 2009 (UTC)Blade bane
The last part of the page says that God summoned an angel to guard the garden. Last time I read that passage, it said that God summoned several flaming guards. Which is it? Has anyone got a bible near them that they can reference? ~[[wikia:User:Blade_bane|<font color="purple">'''Know You Know,'''</font>]] ~ [[halowikia:Special: Contributions/Blade_bane|<font color="purple">'''That Flattery Will Get You Nowhere.'''</font>]]~ 11:00, October 26, 2009 (UTC)Blade bane




Line 70: Line 70:


::I'm religious (well, recently turned religious, so correct me if I'm wrong here), and I find it odd that these connections are even mentioned. They seem to have no relations to the Bible at all. Though, it's obvious that there are a lot of Christianity references in Bungie's games, not just Halo. As for the mythology sections... isn't it odd to say "OMG, they're referencing something that is referenced so much it's common sense to notice it." I mean that for the Norse Mythology section. But that's just me. [[Special:Contributions/98.198.83.12|98.198.83.12]] 03:11, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
::I'm religious (well, recently turned religious, so correct me if I'm wrong here), and I find it odd that these connections are even mentioned. They seem to have no relations to the Bible at all. Though, it's obvious that there are a lot of Christianity references in Bungie's games, not just Halo. As for the mythology sections... isn't it odd to say "OMG, they're referencing something that is referenced so much it's common sense to notice it." I mean that for the Norse Mythology section. But that's just me. [[Special:Contributions/98.198.83.12|98.198.83.12]] 03:11, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
:::What "common sense" references did you have in mind?--[[User:Ocean Soul|Ocean Soul]] ([[User talk:Ocean Soul|talk]]) 23:07, 8 March 2016 (EST)


== Gravemind is Gabriel from Quran ==
== Gravemind is Gabriel from Quran ==
Line 92: Line 94:
I don't mean to offend anyone, we all know religion and the internet don't mix very well, but this article seems a little bias to me. The section that puts different factions representing different things (God = Forerunners, etc.) always puts the Christians as the humans and good guys; there are a lot of different religions referenced in the Halo universe. Now, we know at least a few humans are religious (Dutch), but for the most part it's an non-subject around the humans. I think this is mostly because if the humans were religious too it would make the Covenant seem less crazy and scary by comparison. I always thought of the Covenant as representing religion, all religion, belief in a God or Gods and everything that goes with that. I also think that Christianity (to be specific) in the Halo universe is just as much a misunderstanding of the Forerunners and history as the Covenant's religion. There are obvious things that seem Christian in the Halo universe because in the universe Christianty was formed from the ancient stories of the Forerunners. We learned in Halo: Cryptum that humans were a space capable race, and allies of the (later) Prophets, before the Flood attacked the galaxy, we fought and beat them and developed a cure, but we were also fighting the Forerunners. The Forerunners won and de-evolved the humans back to about the cave man era, but in one last act of spite the humans destroyed the cure to the Flood, and not too long after the Forerunner-Flood war began and we all know how that ended. So the humans would have these stories and legends about the Foreeunners, about space ships, the Flood, the Ark, and all this other stuff from before the Halos were activated. After the few humans were put back on Earth these stories and legends became more and more distant, and (like Telephone) more and more different. The early humans didn't get the concept of aliens, space ships, and all the advanced technology, so the Flood in the stories became a real flood, the Ark became a boat that carried Earth animals, because that's what these early people could understand. All the other smaller details would naturally fall into place. Out of all this these religions were eventually formed. It's not perfect, and I'm not good at explaining it, but it makes enough sense to understand my point. Once again, not tryin' to offend anyone, this is just how I see it. [[User talk:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:21, 10 April 2011 (EDT)
I don't mean to offend anyone, we all know religion and the internet don't mix very well, but this article seems a little bias to me. The section that puts different factions representing different things (God = Forerunners, etc.) always puts the Christians as the humans and good guys; there are a lot of different religions referenced in the Halo universe. Now, we know at least a few humans are religious (Dutch), but for the most part it's an non-subject around the humans. I think this is mostly because if the humans were religious too it would make the Covenant seem less crazy and scary by comparison. I always thought of the Covenant as representing religion, all religion, belief in a God or Gods and everything that goes with that. I also think that Christianity (to be specific) in the Halo universe is just as much a misunderstanding of the Forerunners and history as the Covenant's religion. There are obvious things that seem Christian in the Halo universe because in the universe Christianty was formed from the ancient stories of the Forerunners. We learned in Halo: Cryptum that humans were a space capable race, and allies of the (later) Prophets, before the Flood attacked the galaxy, we fought and beat them and developed a cure, but we were also fighting the Forerunners. The Forerunners won and de-evolved the humans back to about the cave man era, but in one last act of spite the humans destroyed the cure to the Flood, and not too long after the Forerunner-Flood war began and we all know how that ended. So the humans would have these stories and legends about the Foreeunners, about space ships, the Flood, the Ark, and all this other stuff from before the Halos were activated. After the few humans were put back on Earth these stories and legends became more and more distant, and (like Telephone) more and more different. The early humans didn't get the concept of aliens, space ships, and all the advanced technology, so the Flood in the stories became a real flood, the Ark became a boat that carried Earth animals, because that's what these early people could understand. All the other smaller details would naturally fall into place. Out of all this these religions were eventually formed. It's not perfect, and I'm not good at explaining it, but it makes enough sense to understand my point. Once again, not tryin' to offend anyone, this is just how I see it. [[User talk:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] 08:21, 10 April 2011 (EDT)
the parts that with bible verses don't seem to have much to do with the plots of the game butthead4
the parts that with bible verses don't seem to have much to do with the plots of the game butthead4
==Possible==
Wouldn't it be better to name this page List of possible references to religion in the Halo series because we are not sure if some of these are references to religion and they could easily be based on something else, just my thoughts. [[User:Alertfiend|Alertfiend]] - [[Blue Team|Team Chief]] 05:01, 4 January 2016 (EST)
== Clean Up ==
I think the first thing to decide whether the headings should center religions being referenced or subjects related to references? That is, do we list '''The Ark''' and then discuss its relevance to Abrahamic religions or list '''Abrahamic religions''' and then note The Ark's relevance in them? The next step would probably be to work out the hierarchy of the headings.
Next, I think, would be to identify confirmed references and list those in center focus while letting speculation drift to the bottom. Bungie/343i don't confirm everything, letting speculation be a big appeal of the series, so I don't think speculation in and of itself is problematic, but it probably should be relegated to a lesser focus. --<b>[[User:Dragonclaws|<font color="#800080">Dragon<font color="#DE397E">c</font>laws</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Dragonclaws|<font color="#6600D8">talk</font>]])</sup></b> 16:23, 25 September 2018 (EDT)
:Yeah. This is a pretty messy page, and a lot of the "references" are on extremely shaky grounds. I don't really have any decent suggestions other than some pretty sizable cleanup all over the place, particularly when it comes to the more vague parallels. --[[User:Tacitus|Tacitus]] ([[User talk:Tacitus|talk]]) 15:09, 26 September 2018 (EDT)