Editing Talk:Sangheili High Councilor

Image:Councilor2.JPG|300px|right

==Friend or foe==
File:Councillor.jpg|150px|right]]
This picture seems to indicate that you do fight Councilors on Halo 2. And I know I remember fighting them on the level gravemind. yet the page states that you can only fight them if you kill enough of your Elite allies when you are the Arbiter. If someone else doesn't fix it soon I will but I thought I would hand it off to someone with better writing skills. [[User:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]UserWiki:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Editcount/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]11:05, November 5, 2009 (UTC)
:Where is it?--'''<span style="background:Black;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%">[[User:Shade Link|<font color="Green">Shade</font>]]</span>''' 12:57, November 5, 2009 (UTC)

it was [[Councilor#Trivia|here]] but I'm getting rid of it. <font size="3">[[User:Galacticdominator|<font color="black">'''~ '''</font>]]UserWiki:Galacticdominator|<font color="black">'''~'''</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Galacticdominator|<font color="black">'''~ '''</font>]][[Special:Editcount/Galacticdominator|<font color="black">'''~ '''</font>]]</font>17:40, November 7, 2009 (UTC)

==NO TEABAGGING!==

Yesterday, me and my brother were playing The Great Journey on Heroic. Well fighting, we saw an elite with a strange hat that we thought was very cool. Later on, when fighting Tartarus, my brother saw the corpse of a Councilor. For no reason, he teabagged it. And he died. Trust me, It wasn't Tartarus, it was either a glitch or Bungie intended it.

I'd have to do some more checking into it, because I teabagged one and nothing happened, but another and I died. Would it be itneresting to note this? --[[User:Spartan-095|Spartan-095]] 16:56, 31 August 2007 (UTC), from Halo Fanon

see [[Drop Dead on The Great Journey]].
[[User:Halofan|<font color="Green">ĦДĿΘFáЙ</font>]] File:Legendary.jpg|30px]] [[User talk: Halofan|<font color="Red">"ДňḌ áиŐТЋéṜ ĜŗŲṆṭ</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Halofan|bίТËṣ тḤє ḌŲšт"]] 21:05, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Bungie should add that atribute to bodies in multiplayer. [[User:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]UserWiki:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Editcount/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]10:59, November 5, 2009 (UTC)

==Wouldn't it be cool==

If there was a Zealot Councillor, that was the lead political and military figure of all the Elites? Just felt like putting the idea out there --[[User:Justin Time|Justin Time]] 07:34, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

==Highest Rank Arbiter?==
File:Councillor.jpg|150px|thumb|Not going to use this then? Yoink!]]
It can be assumed An [[Arbiter]] is the Highest rank an Elite can have(though they are appointed). -- 67.82.160.199 15:57, 26 December 2006

:I'd say not, since, although it's a great honor to be the Arbiter, AFAWCT they're only appointed in times of great need, and the Elites (probably) need to have a leader other than the prophets, because of the way their society works, and it's meant to be a punishment for deeds as great as letting one of the Halos be destroyed. I'd say he isn't a high rank because he probably does't have ANY rank, and instead it's a position of power aside from their usual system. [[User:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|Guesty-Persony-Thingy]] 16:21, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

::Well, while they might not be higher than Councillors; they are not neccesarily just appointed on those punished for great acts of incompetence. This last Arbiter was the only one we know was held on trial for his incompetence before he became the Arbiter. Maybe the others were just specially efficient Zealots or such which were appointed the rank in a time of need. Maybe the rank is separated from the rest of the system, seeing how it's an appointed one, but if it weren't I'd say it's above Zealot and below Councillor.--[[User:Daas Keter 'Tipheret|High Seraph]] 04:29, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

:::Well, every single one of them has died in the line of duty, and, AFAWCT, been appointed for the dual purposes of serving and doing something special, and dying. '''[[User:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="#000000">G</font><font color="#770000"><sup>ü</sup></font><font color="#cc0000">é</font><font color="#ff0000"><sub>ß</sub></font><font color="#ff3333">Ł</font><font color="#ff6666"><sup>¥</sup></font>]]-[[User talk:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="#9999ff">∏</font><font color="#6666ff"><sub>é</sub></font><font color="#3333ff">Ґ</font><font color="#0000ff"><sup>∫</sup></font><font color="#0000cc">ø</font><font color="#000066"><sub>ñ</sub></font><font color="#000000">¥</font>]]-[[Special:Contributions/Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="#000000"><sup>†</sup></font><font color="#007700">ħ</font><font color="#00cc00"><sub>î</sub></font><font color="#00ff00">И</font><font color="#44ff44"><sup>g</sup></font><font color="#99ff99">¥</font>]]''' 04:34, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

I say that Councillor is the highest POLITICAL rank. Councillors get training in military when they get that political rank, or even during the process of getting it. Arbiter is like a sub-rank. It is just like any other very very high rank, except it is appointed. I mean, the rank Councillor is gained by political experience/military experience, or both. But the Arbiter is appointed by the Prophets, the wisest creatures we have seen so far, not a mere kill-count. (I am NOT saying that I don't like Councillors.) Imagine a field with two Councillors, two Major Elites, and the Arbiter against some brutes. Who would you trust the most? -Just a guest.

The prophets? wise? these aren't biblical prophets and thier irony is in their names. The [[San'Shyuum]] are not wise, they are corrupt. Dispite being called prophets they have no foresight, [[Prophet of Regret|Regret]] doesn't learn from his past mistakes, [[Prophet of Mercy|Mercy]] is merciless and [[Prophet of Truth|Truth]] is a liar. Before the Great Schism I would trust the Councilor. [[User:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]UserWiki:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Editcount/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]11:46, November 5, 2009 (UTC)

== Honor Guard Councilor ==

Why does that Councillor Elite have Honor Guard parts on his legs and arms? I also seen this Councillor while I was playing Halo 2. User:Joshua 029

That's the [[Honor Guard Councilor]], it's a glitch in the game. --[[User:Donut THX 1138|Shch &#39;Nodotee]] 15:16, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

== pic ==
this pic seems to be from halo:CE
:Councillors weren't in ''Halo: CE''. Cheers, <tt>[[user:RelentlessRecusant|49 Proximal Secant]]<sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[User talk:RelentlessRecusant|oracle]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup></tt>File:H3 Monitor.PNG|25px]] 15:47, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
::That is correct, and I took that pic on The Greeat Journey, while the Elite was in the Jail Cell. I also I am wonder why the heck you uploaded another copy of this with random MS paint scribblings on it. --[[User:Dojorkan|Dojorkan]] 12:47, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

== New Pic ==

[[File:Councilor in combat.jpg|right|thumb|130px|oooh!]]

I see you used my pic for the new one of the Councillor, which is okay be me. If you want i've got a ton more images of elites(mostly councillors/zealots), i can upload them if you like.
--[[User:Donut THX 1138|Shch &#39;Nodotee]] 03:15, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

== Overwatch ==

I'm now watching this page and all other elite pages. Making sure no more mistakes are being written, like the [[Arbiter]] rank mistake.
:--[[User:Donut THX 1138|'''Councilor 'Nodotee''']] File:Donut 7.JPG|35px]] <sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[User talk:Donut THX 1138 |BattleNet]]<nowiki>]</nowiki> - <nowiki>[</nowiki>CoH|Covenant of Halopedia]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup> 03:29, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
:But shouldn't you first prove beyond reasnable doubt that Arbiters are not higher than Councillors in hierarchy? I mean, take it out of the page for futher discussion is understandable, but to edit everything else?--[[User:Daas Keter 'Tipheret|High Seraph]] 02:44, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Until someone conclusively proves the Arbiter outranks councilors then I have to agree with Donut. It is safer and more reasonable to assume the councilors outrank the arbiter. Councilors militarily are likely on par with the president if he always had military prowess and the arbiter is his secretary of defense/chiefs of staff. The arbiter has more direct military control but the councilors decide what he does and can overrule him.

==Elite Councillors in the level Uprising?==

OK, i'll be as simple as possible. In the ending cutscene, the arbiter said that the councillors were murdered by the brutes. Except I don't remember the arbiter running into any councillor corpses. Now the only explanation for this is that the dead elite minors found in the beginning of the level were in fact the elite councilors. Proof of that would be that sometimes you can hear the brutes talking about the councilors. The fact that the corpses are minors is answered by the fact that the covenant race of the lowest rank is the only dead rank found. This can be because bungie would like the person to guess their rank (not likely), it takes time to put details in the bodies (probably not), or they feel that as long as the player knows that an elite died, the rest of it doesn't matter (most likely). The fact that only the race with the lowest rank is the only corpse found is further answered on the High Charity level where dead jackal minors are found by beam rifles which are only carried by Jackal snipers. '''Can someone please agree with what I am saying and answer back with what your thoughts are on this topic?''' --[[User:HaloRocks!|HaloRocks!]] 03:35, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps you are right HaloRocks or maybe no councilor bodies are found because brutes recognize their high status and cannibalize the body for any trophies. PS. I know how you feel. If no one bothers to argue or agree with you do your ego a stroke and pretend people like your work and don't want to clutter the page with flattery and praise of your work. PPS. I don't only because I have no self-confidence/ego :( [situation called for first emoticon ever]. Good luck man, us speculators/thinkers got to stick together.

== This is Strange ==

Who Edited the Councilor page to say they wear blackish-purplish robes when not in combat.

==helmet==

Think they'll make a armour permutation based on this? File:HalfJaw03.jpg|20px]] '''[[User:Specops306|<font color=purple>Kora ‘Morhek</font>]]''' ''[[User talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>The Battle-Net</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Specops306|<font color=purple>My Conquests.</font>]]'' 04:44, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Also about the helmet...man, it looks to me like Bungie likes to rip off a lot of stuff. Anyone else think Elite Councilors look like Alien Praetorians from AvP? (the game) [[User:75.37.225.115|75.37.225.115]] 07:27, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Geez, I hope so.

No, that would be a headshot magnet. even worse than the [[Flaming head]] premutation. [[User:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]UserWiki:Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]][[Special:Editcount/Galacticdominator|<span style="color: black; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''~ '''</span>]]11:51, November 5, 2009 (UTC)

Yeah i agree they do look like that type of alien. I haven't seen them to much but on the game i have seen them a little and i agree that they look like Praetorians. also this isnt to related but could someone make a comparison pic between the Queen and Praetorians?[[User talk:SPARTAN-III leader|SPARTAN-III leader]] 22:57, April 17, 2010 (UTC)

It may be a headshot magnet, but Bungie might do what they did with the [[Ascetic Harness]], making a certain hitbox so it doesn't harm players much in combat--'''<span style="background:Black;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%">[[User:Shade Link|<font color="Blue">Shade</font>]]</span>''' 12:09, April 18, 2010 (UTC)

==Aristocrat==

The Bestiarum describes the highest ranked Elites as Aristocrats. Should we rename the article? I don't know where, other than guides, these Elites are ''called'' Councillors, so would Aristocrats be more appropriate? '''[[User:Specops306|<font color=purple>Specops306</font>]]''', '''''[[User talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Kora</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Specops306|<font color=purple>'Morhek</font>]]''''' 03:22, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

The councilor is a Military and and Politlical rank in the COVENANT. Aristocrats, however, are a rank in SANGHEILI CULTURE. ````Unggoy117````

Yeah. And they're the ''Same Thing''. Until the split, the ARISTOCRATS ''were'' in the COVENANT. Therefore, SINCE the Elites are no longer IN the Covenant, I'm saying that it should be RENAMED. And see how annoying fully capitol words can be? Just make it italics next time. '''[[User:Specops306|<font color=purple>Specops306</font>]]''', '''''[[User talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Kora</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Specops306|<font color=purple>'Morhek</font>]]''''' 02:07, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

:Its unclear how the Elites set up their government after they left the Covenant. Nothing is said of Councilors after Halo 2. Maybe all of them died in Halo 2, maybe the Elites set up a new government, and the rank ceased to exist. Either way, there's no need to change the page. --<b>[[User:ED|<font color="black">E</font>]][[User talk:ED|<font color="black">D</font>]]File:ArmyROTC.gif|15px]]</b> 02:11, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

:Then what about, at the least, a separate page for ''Aristocrat''? '''[[User:Specops306|<font color=purple>Specops306</font>]]''', '''''[[User talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Kora</font>]] [[Special:Contributions/Specops306|<font color=purple>'Morhek</font>]]''''' 02:52, 24 December 2007 (UTC)

Aristocrats are lower than Councilors; this would explain why 'Rolamee was allowed to be executed without a trial. Also why he is two steps above Zuka. After all this could place him anywhere from Ultra to Zealot; but I say we remove that he was a Councilor[[User:Councilor 'Rumilee|Councilor &#39;Rumilee]] 21:22, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

== Halo 3 ==

Where do you see a Councilor whoever edited it.--[[User:Councilor 'Rumilee|Councilor &#39;Rumilee]] 21:24, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

== Councilor ==

Its spelled Councilor not Councillor.--[[User:Councilor 'Rumilee|Councilor &#39;Rumilee]] 21:35, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

== New Councilors? ==

I know that this is just an speculation but do you think that after their actions Thel Vadam and Rtas Vadum would become the new councilors after they back to Sanghelios? Becuse as seen in Halo 2 almost all the Councilors were killed by the Brutes so i guess that they would become they new ones.

([[User talk:Marthex|Marthex]] 00:35, 2 March 2009 (UTC))

That is both speculation and fanon, so leave it off of Halopedia. [[User talk:D1134|D1134]] 00:37, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

:I would agree with D1134. And as far as I know, all Councillors did was represent the Sangheili in the High Council of the Covenant. Since the Sangheili secession, they may have returned to an alliance of nations ruled by Kaidons. But since we don't know, we can't say either way. --<b>CoH|<font color=purple>Councillor</font>]]</b> <b>[[User:Specops306|<font color=blue>Specops</font>]]UserWiki:Specops306|<font color=blue>306</font>]] - <i>[[User Talk:Specops306|<font color=purple>Qur'a</font>]] [[halofanon:Operation:_HOT_GATES|<font color=purple>'Morhek</font>]]</i></b> 00:39, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Well so then i agree with both of you, but theres another question then if the Councilors are not more in Elite Rank system i guess that The Kaidons would be the new rulers of the Sangheili, but as told by SpecOps that still unknown.
([[User talk:Marthex|Marthex]] 00:59, 2 March 2009 (UTC))

[[File:Elite_walk-00.jpg|thumb|Return of the councilor?]]

This is a new render made by Bungie of a new Elite. The helmet looks like a '''simplified''' Councilor helmet to me. Could this mark the return of the Councilor to Halo Reach?

[[User talk:Daget Sparrow|Capt. Daget J. Sparrow]] 06:10, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

:Unlikely. It looks like a helmet variant for the Elites, similar to the ones we see in HCE.- <font face="Century Gothic">[[User:Subtank|<font color="gold"><font color="#FF4F00">5</font>əb<font color="#FF4F00">'7</font>aŋk</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Subtank|<font color="#FF4F00">7alk</font>]])</sup></font> 13:50, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

I beg to differ. Both helmet designs (for this Elite and Halo 2 councilors) are extremely similar. The only major difference is the size and a piece running through it's middle.

Well, what is this render is of a councilor's field uniform? The councilors in Halo 2 were imprisoned, and did not have time to change to their combat gear, but if a councilor were knowingly going into intense combat they'd likely want more practical gear (like a smaller head-dress). [[User talk:D3in0nychu5|D3in0nychu5]] 17:59, March 17, 2010 (UTC)

Not to say ur an idiot, but do you rly think that they would put them in cobat for normal soldiers? think about it, but yes I did think they were when i first saw them.[[User talk:SPARTAN-III leader|SPARTAN-III leader]] 22:53, April 17, 2010 (UTC)

== Sangheili Councilor helmet ==

[[File:Sangheili_Councilor_Helmet_design.svg|250 px|right]]

Subtank, instead of us going back and forth perhaps we should discuss the file I am trying to add to the page. I have not spent a lot of time here editing so I'm not as familiar with the policies. I spoke with Smoke in the chat and he had this to say:

:<[Smoke]> Discuss it with her
:<[Smoke]> I saw the image in question, it doesn't look too different
:<[Smoke]> Her issue seems to be that it's a fan-created image, which is usually looked down on here.
:<[Smoke]> If you're wrong, you're wrong, but you won't know unless you two at least attempt to come to a consensus.

Someone else in the chat pointed this out:

:<Uncle_Karlo> for instance... the Flood Walk image is fan art, but is allowed because it doesn't counter anything

I understand that your issue is that it is fan-made and I am more than happy to debate that point with you but there is a distinction between fan-made and fannon (in my opinion). To me, fannon is something created by a fan that doesn't already exist that is presented as cannon. My image, although fan-made, is based on the existing councilor's helmet design. If you compare the two you will see that they are quite close. My image doesn't counter anything else in the article or on halopedia so I think it is acceptable to include it. If you would like it to have a thumbnail description that makes it more obvious that it's not official canon I am fine with that.

Alternatively, if you really would like to push the issue I can take it to the FanArt Committee: http://halopedian.com/Halopedia:FanArt_Rulings and get approval there first.

I want to follow the rules and work within the guidelines. I'm not taking any offense to my edits being reverted (fyi). Hopefully we can come to a resolution.{{Unsigned|DannyBoy7783}}
:Glad that you talked to Smoke. and used the talk page.
:First of all, please provide the link for the Flood Walk image. I'm trying to find all the fan-made images and tagging them for deletion process. If you didn't know, Halopedia is running its major cleanup on all articles, files and formats. Secondly, I appreciate that you've drawn this Councilor helmet design and saved it in SVG form (Thumbs up for that. :D ). As of now, I'm trying to compare your design with the current Councilor model and see to what extent it is similar and whether or not it could be used in this article. This is also the reason why I chose not to remove your Helmet Design from Halopedia because of its potential use. It would take some time, so please be patient and wait. This is also to avoid from opening the floodgate issue (Where if I allow one fan-made image to be on an article, others would try to do it too and we would have quantity over quality). Thirdly, the FanArt Committee has been disbanded, and as such, all previous proposals are dismissed.- <font face="Century Gothic">[[User:Subtank|<font color="gold"><font color="#FF4F00">5</font>əb<font color="#FF4F00">'7</font>aŋk</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Subtank|<font color="#FF4F00">7alk</font>]])</sup></font> 18:02, January 31, 2010 (UTC)
:: Wish I knew that committee was disbanded! I just posted my file there, haha! I didn't see it mentioned on the page if it was noted. [[File:FloodWalk.PNG|right|100px|thumb|FloodWalk.PNG]]
::I understand the whole flood gates issue. I used to do a lot of editing at wookieepedia and they had a VERY strict policy there. I do see your argument and it is a valid one. I made this drawing years ago and was going through a folder and saw it and I thought "hey, maybe I can use this at halopedia!" so hopefully we can find a home for it. --[[User talk:DannyBoy7783|DannyBoy7783]] 18:18, January 31, 2010 (UTC)
:::Just to let you know that your claim would fail if your precedent would be the FloodWalk image. Added to the article.- <font face="Century Gothic">[[User:Subtank|<font color="gold"><font color="#FF4F00">5</font>əb<font color="#FF4F00">'7</font>aŋk</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Subtank|<font color="#FF4F00">7alk</font>]])</sup></font> 20:56, January 31, 2010 (UTC)
::::I wasn't relying on FloodWalk to get me past any review process but there are some fan images here and there...though they are rare I will admit. --[[User talk:DannyBoy7783|DannyBoy7783]] 23:02, January 31, 2010 (UTC)
:::::Why don't you guys post it on photobucket? Then you can use it.--'''<span style="background:Black;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%">[[User:Shade Link|<font color="Blue">Shade</font>]]</span>''' 19:41, February 27, 2010 (UTC)

Or you can use it on your userpage.--'''<span style="background:Black;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%">[[User:Shade Link|<font color="Blue">Shade</font>]]</span>''' 19:42, February 27, 2010 (UTC)
==Sight==
After closely examining the the head-dress I noticed that their eyes are not visible. Do they see through the small opening in the front of their helmet, or do they have some sort of HUD?[[User:Kuhgrok 'Anthormee|~''<font color="gray"><font size="4pt"><font face="Freshbot">Kuhgrok 'Anthormee</font></font></font>'']] 04:35, June 19, 2010 (UTC)