Editing Talk:Proto-Gravemind
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Does anyone have a picture of the ones that pilot pelicans in Halo 2?--[[User:Leckgolo434|prophit of war]] 22:24, 15 November 2006 (UTC) | Does anyone have a picture of the ones that pilot pelicans in Halo 2?--[[User:Leckgolo434|prophit of war]] 22:24, 15 November 2006 (UTC) | ||
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== nomenclature == | == nomenclature == | ||
You know, where exactly does the term ''Brain Form'' come from anyway? I was always under the assumption that it was called a ''Commander Form''. I forgot where i got that term, but I never saw Brain form until i saw it on an old fansite. '''<tt>[[user:Dude984|<font color=green>Dude984</font>]]</tt>''' <sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[user talk:Dude984|Communications]]<nowiki>]</nowiki>-<nowiki>[</nowiki>[[Special:Contributions/Dude984|Contributions]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup> | You know, where exactly does the term ''Brain Form'' come from anyway? I was always under the assumption that it was called a ''Commander Form''. I forgot where i got that term, but I never saw Brain form until i saw it on an old fansite. '''<tt>[[user:Dude984|<font color=green>Dude984</font>]]</tt>''' <sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[user talk:Dude984|Communications]]<nowiki>]</nowiki>-<nowiki>[</nowiki>[[Special:Contributions/Dude984|Contributions]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup>[[Image:Dude avatar copy.gif|25px]] 02:43, 9 March 2007 (UTC) | ||
:I don't know for sure, but most of this comes from HBO. --<b>[[User:Dragonclaws|<font color="000000">Dragon<font color="FF0000">c</font>laws</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Dragonclaws|<font color="000000">talk</font>]])</sup></b> 02:45, 9 March 2007 (UTC) | :I don't know for sure, but most of this comes from HBO. --<b>[[User:Dragonclaws|<font color="000000">Dragon<font color="FF0000">c</font>laws</font>]]<sup>([[User talk:Dragonclaws|<font color="000000">talk</font>]])</sup></b> 02:45, 9 March 2007 (UTC) | ||
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{{Support}} Protos may be made of multiple brain forms, we have no clear evidence that a Proto-Gravemind is the exact same as a Brain Form. [[User:Spartan 112|Spartan 112]] 15:55, 31 December 2007 (UTC) | {{Support}} Protos may be made of multiple brain forms, we have no clear evidence that a Proto-Gravemind is the exact same as a Brain Form. [[User:Spartan 112|Spartan 112]] 15:55, 31 December 2007 (UTC) | ||
::My main problem with the name brain form is that its never mentioned in Halo games, novels, comics, etc. Its not mentioned ''Anywhere''. The Beastarium, which mentions species not seen in the games like the Engineers and Precursors, doesn't mention "Brain Form" anywhere. And its Bungie's definitive source on '''all''' halo species. --[[User:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">Elite</font>''']][[User talk:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">Spartan</font>''']] | ::My main problem with the name brain form is that its never mentioned in Halo games, novels, comics, etc. Its not mentioned ''Anywhere''. The Beastarium, which mentions species not seen in the games like the Engineers and Precursors, doesn't mention "Brain Form" anywhere. And its Bungie's definitive source on '''all''' halo species. --[[User:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">Elite</font>''']][[User talk:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">Spartan</font>''']][[Image:MVP achievement.gif|30px]] 17:36, 31 December 2007 (UTC) | ||
{{Support}} Their is no evidence that the proto-gravemind and brain form are the same. And I remember Brain form | {{Support}} Their is no evidence that the proto-gravemind and brain form are the same. And I remember Brain form | ||
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===Against=== | ===Against=== | ||
{{Oppose}}What does halo 1 have anything to do with a gravemind in halo 2 and 3?--''' | {{Oppose}}What does halo 1 have anything to do with a gravemind in halo 2 and 3?--'''[[Halopedia:UNSC of Halopedia/Council|<font color="DarkOrange">General</font>]]''' '''[[User:Ryanngreenday|<font color="DarkOrange">Running</font>]]''' '''[[User talk:Ryanngreenday|<font color="DarkOrange">Riot</font>]] [[User:Ryanngreenday/Me|<font color="red">R</font>]][[User:Ryanngreenday/Time line of Ryan|<font color="red">y</font>]][[User:Ryanngreenday/USER BOX|<font color="red">a</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Ryanngreenday|<font color="red">n</font>]]'''[[Image:'s_emblem.jpg|15px]] 22:49, 3 November 2007 (UTC) | ||
{{Oppose}}Can't be done. Brain form is a made up fan name. Proto-Gravemind is the name given by bungie. --[[User:EliteSpartan|<b><span style="color: Green">EliteSpartan</span></b>]] | {{Oppose}}Can't be done. Brain form is a made up fan name. Proto-Gravemind is the name given by bungie. --[[User:EliteSpartan|<b><span style="color: Green">EliteSpartan</span></b>]][[Image:Killing Spree Medal.gif|30px]] <sup>[[User talk:EliteSpartan|<b><span style="color: Black">My Talk</span></b>]]</sup> <sub>[[Special:Contributions/EliteSpartan|<b><font color=black>My Contribs</font></b>]]</sub>[[Image:Sergeant.jpg|30px]][[Image:GDI.jpg|30px]] November 5 2007 | ||
::It is never said that THIS was a proto-gravemind, only that "a Gravemind is formed when a Proto-Graveming reaches critical mass" annd not "A proto-gravemind is a brainform, go screw up all of our fan's lives", retard . | ::It is never said that THIS was a proto-gravemind, only that "a Gravemind is formed when a Proto-Graveming reaches critical mass" annd not "A proto-gravemind is a brainform, go screw up all of our fan's lives", retard . | ||
:::The beastarium(which has the info on ALL halo species) never even mentions a "Brain Form". All evidence points to this creature being a proto-gravemind. Calm down stuff gets renamed all the time its not a big deal.--[[User:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">EliteSpartan</font>''']] | :::The beastarium(which has the info on ALL halo species) never even mentions a "Brain Form". All evidence points to this creature being a proto-gravemind. Calm down stuff gets renamed all the time its not a big deal.--[[User:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Green">EliteSpartan</font>''']] [[Image:Sergeant-gr3.gif|25px]] <sup>[[User talk:EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Black">My Talk</font>''']]</sup><sub>[[Special:Contributions/EliteSpartan|'''<font color="Black">My Contribs</font>''']]</sub>[[Image:Cavalier achievement.gif|30px]] 21:52, 9 December 2007 (UTC) | ||
::Evidence? "Protogravemind" only said once! I don't even count Bestiaruim (the DVD spelling) or any books as canon unless mentioned or noted in the games. The books are not by Bungie, just by some guy in Washington (My home state). I should just ask them, It's about an hour drive from my house anyways. {{unsigned|71.112.156.166}} | ::Evidence? "Protogravemind" only said once! I don't even count Bestiaruim (the DVD spelling) or any books as canon unless mentioned or noted in the games. The books are not by Bungie, just by some guy in Washington (My home state). I should just ask them, It's about an hour drive from my house anyways. {{unsigned|71.112.156.166}} | ||
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{{Oppose}} Official names FTW!!! '''[[User:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="red">Guesty</font>]]-[[User talk:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="blue">Persony</font>]]-[[Special:Contributions/Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="green">Thingy</font>]]''' 07:03, 1 January 2008 (UTC) | {{Oppose}} Official names FTW!!! '''[[User:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="red">Guesty</font>]]-[[User talk:Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="blue">Persony</font>]]-[[Special:Contributions/Guesty-Persony-Thingy|<font color="green">Thingy</font>]]''' 07:03, 1 January 2008 (UTC) | ||
{{Oppose}} Agreed. Official names take precedence over fan names. [[User:Calgar|'''Rima 'Lacusee''']] | {{Oppose}} Agreed. Official names take precedence over fan names. [[User:Calgar|'''Rima 'Lacusee''']] [[Image:MinorElite5.jpg|24px]] <sup>|[[User talk:Calgar|Talk]]|Minor Domo of the [[Halopedia:Covenant of Halopedia|Covenant]]|</sup> 10:33, 3 January 2008 (UTC) | ||
{{Oppose}} Sorry boys, it needs to stay Proto-Gravemind. It's like calling the Chief John instead of John-117 --[[wikia:godzilla:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color="green">The Lord of Monster Island</font>]] <sup>[[wikia:unhalo:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#660099>The Lord of Grunts</font>]]</sup> <sub>[[halowikia:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#FFCC00>SPARTAN-012 James</font>]]</sub> <sup>[[halofanon:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#00FF00>MCPO James Davis</font>]]</sup> <sub>[[User talk:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#33FFFF>I here your cries</font>]]</sub> <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#CC3333>May your works be honorable</font>]]</sup> 20:36, 4 January 2008 (UTC) | {{Oppose}} Sorry boys, it needs to stay Proto-Gravemind. It's like calling the Chief John instead of John-117 --[[wikia:godzilla:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color="green">The Lord of Monster Island</font>]] <sup>[[wikia:unhalo:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#660099>The Lord of Grunts</font>]]</sup> <sub>[[halowikia:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#FFCC00>SPARTAN-012 James</font>]]</sub> <sup>[[halofanon:User:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#00FF00>MCPO James Davis</font>]]</sup> <sub>[[User talk:Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#33FFFF>I here your cries</font>]]</sub> <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Lordofmonsterisland|<font color=#CC3333>May your works be honorable</font>]]</sup> 20:36, 4 January 2008 (UTC) | ||
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:#*Now say he needs to pilot fifty ships. So he has his Combat Forms construct fifty Proto-Graveminds. Then, he relays general commands to the Proto-Graveminds, which act as [[Wikipedia:network hub|network hub]]s, simplifying the Gravemind's operations by lightening the load, so to speak. He gives a general command to the Proto-Gravemind, and the uncooked gravy decides how best to execute that command given its immediate surroundings and the available Flood forms within those surroundings. | :#*Now say he needs to pilot fifty ships. So he has his Combat Forms construct fifty Proto-Graveminds. Then, he relays general commands to the Proto-Graveminds, which act as [[Wikipedia:network hub|network hub]]s, simplifying the Gravemind's operations by lightening the load, so to speak. He gives a general command to the Proto-Gravemind, and the uncooked gravy decides how best to execute that command given its immediate surroundings and the available Flood forms within those surroundings. | ||
:#Given such a setup, subordinate Proto-Graveminds wouldn't want to increase in mass because there's already enough gravy to go around. All Flood forms have a linked mind, the Gravemind's mind... so if two Graveminds were to be formed "within range" of each other, their minds would likely be linked. Do you really think that an egotistical -- and likely narcissistic -- being who hates being outsmarted and obviously doesn't work with others would [[Wikipedia:Dissociative identity disorder|get along with itself]]? Neither do I. | :#Given such a setup, subordinate Proto-Graveminds wouldn't want to increase in mass because there's already enough gravy to go around. All Flood forms have a linked mind, the Gravemind's mind... so if two Graveminds were to be formed "within range" of each other, their minds would likely be linked. Do you really think that an egotistical -- and likely narcissistic -- being who hates being outsmarted and obviously doesn't work with others would [[Wikipedia:Dissociative identity disorder|get along with itself]]? Neither do I. | ||
:So my basic argument, then, is that Brain Forms and Proto-Graveminds are formed the same way, the Gravemind is like the center of a Star network, Proto-Graveminds act like hubs when there's already a Gravemind, and subordinate Proto-Graveminds limit their growth so as to prevent the Gravemind from being affected by multiple personality disorder. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b> | :So my basic argument, then, is that Brain Forms and Proto-Graveminds are formed the same way, the Gravemind is like the center of a Star network, Proto-Graveminds act like hubs when there's already a Gravemind, and subordinate Proto-Graveminds limit their growth so as to prevent the Gravemind from being affected by multiple personality disorder. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b>[[Image:DavidJCobb_Emblem.svg|16px]] [[User:DavidJCobb|<span style="color:#000;position:relative;top:.15em">DavidJCobb </span>]]</b></span> 22:15, September 2, 2009 (UTC) | ||
::Haha, Mr. Cobb, I do believe I'd have to agree with the majority of your analysis. And sorry about the paragraph breaks. I wasn't really thinking about formatting at the time. | ::Haha, Mr. Cobb, I do believe I'd have to agree with the majority of your analysis. And sorry about the paragraph breaks. I wasn't really thinking about formatting at the time. | ||
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:::Well, under my theory, all Flood can act as a kind of hub (relaying Gravy's commands to other nearby Flood), but Proto-Graveminds receive delegation -- unlike Combat Forms, uncooked gravy would, under my theory, receive ''general'' instructions, and be granted the freedom to execute those instructions as it sees fit, with control over any nearby resources (like other Flood forms). ''If'' this theory is correct, then a Proto-Gravemind would be a Flood form with sufficient intelligence ''and'' authority to make its own low-level decisions about how to accomplish Gravy's higher-level goals. If a normal Flood form just passes information, then a Proto-Gravemind could be a Flood form that makes small decisions in addition to passing information. | :::Well, under my theory, all Flood can act as a kind of hub (relaying Gravy's commands to other nearby Flood), but Proto-Graveminds receive delegation -- unlike Combat Forms, uncooked gravy would, under my theory, receive ''general'' instructions, and be granted the freedom to execute those instructions as it sees fit, with control over any nearby resources (like other Flood forms). ''If'' this theory is correct, then a Proto-Gravemind would be a Flood form with sufficient intelligence ''and'' authority to make its own low-level decisions about how to accomplish Gravy's higher-level goals. If a normal Flood form just passes information, then a Proto-Gravemind could be a Flood form that makes small decisions in addition to passing information. | ||
:::Nevertheless, though, this is somewhat mysterious. Hopefully, more about the Flood's enigmatic nature will be revealed -- there's still flood on Delta Halo and outside the Milky Way Galaxy, and the Flood-Forerunner War remains largely a mystery, so Bungie and/or 343 Industries has plenty to work with. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b> | :::Nevertheless, though, this is somewhat mysterious. Hopefully, more about the Flood's enigmatic nature will be revealed -- there's still flood on Delta Halo and outside the Milky Way Galaxy, and the Flood-Forerunner War remains largely a mystery, so Bungie and/or 343 Industries has plenty to work with. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b>[[Image:DavidJCobb_Emblem.svg|16px]] [[User:DavidJCobb|<span style="color:#000;position:relative;top:.15em">DavidJCobb </span>]]</b></span> 19:52, September 10, 2009 (UTC) | ||
::::That is to say, think of a Proto-Gravemind as the regional manager at your local McDonalds. He gets general commands from the big guys, and gives specific commands to the employees. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b> | ::::That is to say, think of a Proto-Gravemind as the regional manager at your local McDonalds. He gets general commands from the big guys, and gives specific commands to the employees. <span style="background:#AADDAA;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%"><b>[[Image:DavidJCobb_Emblem.svg|16px]] [[User:DavidJCobb|<span style="color:#000;position:relative;top:.15em">DavidJCobb </span>]]</b></span> 19:55, September 10, 2009 (UTC) | ||
I am going to agre with you on this, David, "Proto-Gravemind" is the official name of this Flood form (and ''Halo Wars'' proves it since when you click on the Proto-Gravemind,it says "Proto-Gravemind" , and ''Halo Wars'' is an official canon in the ''Halo'' series, and I am getting tiered of people saying it's not, it ''IS''. Just because it is not developed by Bungie does not mean it is not apart of the series, thats like saying a guy who has a wife and some kids that are his kids cheats on his wife with another women that gives birth to a baby and people say that baby is not his kid, but it is) and Gravemind may have formed from a Proto-Gravemind, but remember, Gravemind is the leader of the Flood and there is only one of him, but theres more than one Proto-Gravemind, because the Proto-Gravemind is a different flood form and serves the roles of general (keeping an eye on the other Flood forms for Gravemind, which the one in ''Halo Wars'' dose) and as pilot of a spaceship that needs a higher intellegence for pilot (whch the one in ''Halo 1'' and the one in the ''Halo Graphic Novel'' do because those I think are defenitly Proto-Graveminds) under the comand of Gravemind,who has the role as the Flood's leader, and all other Flood forms have the role as the troops. Yet the only simmilaritys that I found between Gravemind and the Proto-Graveminds is the name (duh XP) and that they both consum and absorb the bodies of sentient life forms to grow (but Gravemind grows unlimetly, for a Proto-Gravemind just need a specific amount.), so I hope that sums it all up. - Annonimus October 14, 2009 10:19 pm (UTC) | I am going to agre with you on this, David, "Proto-Gravemind" is the official name of this Flood form (and ''Halo Wars'' proves it since when you click on the Proto-Gravemind,it says "Proto-Gravemind" , and ''Halo Wars'' is an official canon in the ''Halo'' series, and I am getting tiered of people saying it's not, it ''IS''. Just because it is not developed by Bungie does not mean it is not apart of the series, thats like saying a guy who has a wife and some kids that are his kids cheats on his wife with another women that gives birth to a baby and people say that baby is not his kid, but it is) and Gravemind may have formed from a Proto-Gravemind, but remember, Gravemind is the leader of the Flood and there is only one of him, but theres more than one Proto-Gravemind, because the Proto-Gravemind is a different flood form and serves the roles of general (keeping an eye on the other Flood forms for Gravemind, which the one in ''Halo Wars'' dose) and as pilot of a spaceship that needs a higher intellegence for pilot (whch the one in ''Halo 1'' and the one in the ''Halo Graphic Novel'' do because those I think are defenitly Proto-Graveminds) under the comand of Gravemind,who has the role as the Flood's leader, and all other Flood forms have the role as the troops. Yet the only simmilaritys that I found between Gravemind and the Proto-Graveminds is the name (duh XP) and that they both consum and absorb the bodies of sentient life forms to grow (but Gravemind grows unlimetly, for a Proto-Gravemind just need a specific amount.), so I hope that sums it all up. - Annonimus October 14, 2009 10:19 pm (UTC) |