Editing Talk:Marcus Stacker

== Issue with picture ==
One picture of Stacker from Halo: Combat Evolved one shows him on the silent cartagrapher, but if you look at gunnery sergeant [[Waller]]'s page you will see that it has the EXACT same picture only claiming him to be Waller instead of Stacker should we just remove it from one of the sergeant's page or remove both of them? I know Waller replaced Stacker in the books but still that is Stacker. [[User:cloakedshadow]]

== Death? ==

Dose he Die when the covenant crusier destroys the city and if he did or diden't it should be added on the artical [[User:Kami-Sama]]

No, actually, you will see Sergeant Stacker in his ODST suit on the level "Delta Halo". But he has his helmet on, so you can't tell it's him. When you start out on the level, smack the second ODST that you see running down the hill with an SMG. He will have the voice of Pete Stacker. In Regret, he is one of the normal Marines you can find on the Pelicans. -Blemo 01:24, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the ODST at the start of Delta Halo is more often Sergeant Banks. But neither of them die since both of them appear jus before you have to provide airsupport for Johnson in his Scarab. Whether or not the survived it can be debated.--[[User:Lieutenant Alan|Lieutenant Alan]] 07:35, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Sometimes, their voices will vary between Banks and Stacker... I forgot to mention that. --[[user:Blemo|<font color="#D3D3D3">B</font><font color="#A9A9A9">le</font><font color="#808080">mo</font>]] http://www.wikia.com/skins/common/progress-wheel.gif <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">TALK</font>]]</sup> • <sub>  [http://halopedian.com/Special:Contributions/Blemo <font color="A9A9A9">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]</sub></small> 20:00, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Hes also in the last level when Arbiter rescues Sergeant Stacker, Avery Johnson and Marcus Banks And he is in Halo 3[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:37, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

== Halo 3 == 
Where does it ever say he is going to be in Halo 3. We know only one marine name that is going to be in Halo 3 and that is Sgt. Johnson.[[User:Darth Gree|'''<font color="olive">The Consumed</font>''']] [[User Talk:Darth Gree|'''<font color="brown">,The Dead</font>''']] [[Special:Contributions/Darth Gree|'''<font color="purple">,and Living</font>''']]
File:ESE.JPG|20px]] 22:43, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
 
yea why is he even important or where does it say that he is gonna come in halo 3?--[[User:Radzon|Radzon]] 00:07, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

:You can see him getting "this is spartaaaaaaaa'd" by the Brute Chief in the E3 trailer. -[[User:Azathoth|<font color="black">''theblackthrone''</font>]] [[User talk:Azathoth|<font color="black"><sub>(atthecenter)</sub></font>]]  [[Special:Contributions/Azathoth|<font color="black"><sub>(ofultimatechaos)</sub></font>]] 19:58, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Stacker's not the most important character, but he does play a couple important roles. He does hold off the Brutes and allows Johnson to get the Scarab in Halo 2. Without that help, the Scarab likely would not have been taken by Johnson, who in turn would not have lowered Tartarus' shields, which in turn would have killed the Arbiter, which in turn would have led to the death of Master Chief. Also, he is one of the leaders of the marine resistance in Halo 3. [[User:Holly-102|Holly-102]] 21:30, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Um... what?! Pete Stacker wasn't with Johnson on the scarab in halo 2...
[[User:Sgt.johnson|'''<font color="Red">The Sarge</font>''']] File:Marine Corp 1stSgt.jpg|25px]]<sup>[[User talk:Sgt.johnson|<font color="Gold">Comm</font>]]</sup> <sub>[[Special:Contributions/Sgt.johnson|<font color="Red">CSV</font>]]</sub> 21:31, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

He appears right before you provide air support for Johnson in The Great Journal. Apparently, Johnson, Stacker, and Banks were going to be executed, and then they tried to fight off the Brutes right before the Arbiter arrived up there. [[User:Holly-102|Holly-102]] 23:17, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

== Merge with the other Sergeant Stacker? ==

Pete and Sgt. Stacker from Halo 1 very much appear to be the same person. They have the same voice actor, the same (sur)name, and their names in the credits of Halos 1 and 2 are the same. So, could someone please merge these articles?--[[User:Commander Jake|CT-5619]] <sup>[[User talk:Commander Jake|helmet comlink]]</sup> 22:32, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
:In [[Halo: First Strike]], the humans who made it off [[Installation 04]] were all named, and the only ones who survived to reach [[Earth]] were [[John-117]], [[Cortana]] and [[Avery J. Johnson|Johnson]]. The only way Stacker could have got off was on another Covenant ship, which would cause *much* bigger plot problems than if he simply had a brother or something. --[[User:68.44.13.236|68.44.13.236]] 18:43, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
::Maybe so, but then why the hell would there be three men with the same name, voice actor, face, and rank? Someone really should ask Frankie O'Connor about this.--[[User:Commander Jake|CT-5619]] <sup>[[User talk:Commander Jake|helmet comlink]]</sup> 19:05, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
:::Name: He's not an important enough character to come up with an original name. Voice actor: Obvious. Face: Possibly see "name". Rank: Possibly they really liked his persona from the first game, which wouldn't really work if he were a grunt. (Also, you really only need an excuse to copy a character once; after that it becomes a tradition.) --[[User:68.44.13.236|68.44.13.236]] 04:34, 16 September 2007 (UTC)
::::Perhaps he was merely edited by bungie. They have just wonted to make him look older in Halo 3. Also, he may just been one of those voices that are placed on random characters, only he was more different. --{{unsigned|Hydraman}} (17:38, 7 October 2007)
::::Blah, I think he's the same person. I think the games have more weight than the books, after all the games are the fundamental parts of the Halo universe. OR for all you who can't possibly believe that explanation, maybe he's someone who isn't cannon at all. Maybe he's just a character that they put in the games. He is always the "other Sergeant". In the first game, Johnson was the Sergeant that would be considered the "main one." In Halo 2, Sergeant Banks is the guy in charge of that fort thing you find and "leads" the attack on the Scarab. In Halo 3, Sergeant Reynolds is the one you rescue from the Brutes. See, there are always two Sergeants that can die in the games, and Stacker is always the "other one." If there is a game that takes place many many years after Halo 3, who knows, Maybe Stacker will show up again to aid you in combat. Personally, I prefer my first explanation but the second one is likely as well. [[User:Imperialscouts]]

In Halo CE He fires more accurately than Johnson, IN Halo 2 Banks only aids You Twice, opposed to stacker aiding you 4 times and in halo 3 it is stackers squad that saves reynolds ass twice and he aids you on every level and He even leads the marines  and ODSTs in the Scarab fights in the ark And the Covenant so in Halo 1 Johnson is the main sarge, but in 2&3 Stacker is, take that[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 06:00, November 1, 2009 (UTC) 

Remember that no one truly knows how Johnson got off Halo.  If Avery did than I'm sure Stacker could have found a way.  Perhaps all the sergeants worked together to get off. --[[User:71.171.111.82|71.171.111.82]]
:Good point. By the way, be sure to sign your comments. [[User:Imperialscouts]]
:You know stacker may have refused to go on the covenant ship and probably along with Chips Dubbo escaped with a pelican.  Edd1997
:Johnson got from Alpha Halo to Earth in a captured Covenant ship, ''[[Ascendant Justice]]'' - see First Strike. --[[User:68.44.253.17|68.44.253.17]] 07:32, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

== Move article? ==

It seems logical to move this article to something like Pete Stacker (character) or Pete Stacker (Halo 2), and and have [[Pete Stacker]] be a page about the actual person (the voice actor). Also, apparently whoever wrote the latest version of the [[Stacker]] disambiguation page thinks the one in [[Halo 2]] and the one in [[Another Day at the Beach]] are necessarily different? --[[User:68.44.13.236|68.44.13.236]] 23:25, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

== Race ==

What is Stacker's race? He looks black to me, but another Halo player insists he is white. - Hyenaste 21:15, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
:You may be talking about [[Sergeant Major Avery J. Johnson]] or [[Marcus Banks]]. Please check. --[[user:Blemo|<font color="#D3D3D3">B</font><font color="#A9A9A9">le</font><font color="#808080">mo</font>]] http://www.wikia.com/skins/common/progress-wheel.gif <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">TALK</font>]]</sup> • <sub>  [http://halopedian.com/Special:Contributions/Blemo <font color="A9A9A9">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]</sub></small> • <sub><small>[http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Halo3/Default.aspx?player=Blemo+23 <font color="A9A9A9">SERVICE RECORD</font>]</small></sub> 01:35, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

I think you gotta adjust your TV, he looks pretty white to me. [[User:207.119.116.44|207.119.116.44]] 00:48, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
:That's because he IS white, lol. --[[User:Blemo|<span style="color: steelblue; font-family: Arial; font-size: 10pt;">'''Blemo'''</span>]] http://www.wikia.com/skins/common/progress-wheel.gif <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="royalblue">TALK</font>]]</sup> • <sub>  [http://halopedian.com/Special:Contributions/Blemo <font color="lightblue">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]</sub></small> • <sub><small>[http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Halo3/Default.aspx?player=Blemo+23 <font color="teal">SERVICE RECORD</font>]</small></sub> • <sub><small><font color="olivedrab"><span style="font-weight: light;" title="''Loser''. noun -- Anyone that is dumb enough to stare at a message on someone's signature for no apparent reason. You reading this pretty much proves the point.">MESSAGE</span></font></small></sub> 05:32, 1 December 2007 (UTC)

== Halo 1 Stacker retconned out? ==

I submit that Bungie has retconned H:CE Stacker out. He wasn't one of the survivors mentioned in First Strike, he's clearly alive in 2 & 3 and all his H:CE appearances were replaced with other characters in The Flood. I think it's far more likely that he retroactively wasn't on Halo than he had an identical twin brother, was forgotten in First Strike or somehow managed to get off Halo, get a ship with a Slipspace drive and pilot home ''all on his own''. --[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 00:30, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
:I think they just used the same voice actor because he was already on a payroll, but no one else seems to want to accept this. --<b>[[User:ED|<font color="black">E</font>]][[User talk:ED|<font color="black">D</font>]]File:ArmyROTC.gif|15px]]</b> 00:36, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
::Well, that too. :) --[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 00:41, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
:As was recently mentioned by [http://carnage.bungie.org/haloforum/halo.forum.pl?read=847640 Staten], the games trump the books in official Halo continuity. Also, the front page specifies that this is a wiki documenting the universe of the games as augmented by the books, not the other way around. --[[User:Andrew Nagy|Andrew Nagy]] 07:02, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
::If that's an official ruling, I guess the discussion's over. As long as you're here, do you have an official ruling on the remaining options: That there were 2 Stackers, they forgot to put him in First Strike, or he escaped on his own?--[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 17:56, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
:::No idea. Sorry for missing the question when you originally posted it. On rereading the thread I'm not sure it's any of those; the games seem to be canon for the broad strokes of the plot and cutscenes, not the fine details of which Marines appear where. IIRC Johnson can appear on AotCR when he's supposed to have left with Keyes, so maybe it's the same way with Stacker. --[[User talk:Andrew Nagy|Andrew Nagy]] 19:01, August 16, 2010 (UTC)

They forgot to put him in first strike[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:40, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

I reckon that the author of the flood had the lines to write in the book, but couldn't be stuffed to get the name so he made one up. anyway stacker has to be the awesomest minor character in the halo universe!!!!!!!!!!![[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:15, November 2, 2009 (UTC)


:::"Stacker" may simply be a common name at that time. --<b>[[User:ED|<font color="black">E</font>]][[User talk:ED|<font color="black">D</font>]]File:ArmyROTC.gif|15px]]</b> 20:12, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
:With the same face and voice, too? At the very least they're related.--[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 22:12, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

==Stacker==

Are they all the same guy? Cause... I don't think so... <b>[[User:Sgt.johnson|<font color="Black">A</font>]][[User talk:Sgt.johnson|<font color="Black">J</font>]]File:ArmyJROTC.jpg|20px]]</b> 03:20, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
:I'll bite. Why not? The improbability of Halo 1 Stacker living?--[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 21:20, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

::That for one thing, and the fact that the halo 2 Stacker looks nothing like the halo 3 stacker. <b>[[User:Sgt.johnson|<font color="Black">A</font>]][[User talk:Sgt.johnson|<font color="Black">J</font>]]File:ArmyJROTC.jpg|20px]]</b> 21:24, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
:::Do you have a picture for comparison? I'm having trouble finding one.--[[User:Pcm979|Pcm979]] 22:12, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

::::Well that's easy... IT'S ON THE ARTICLE! AJ: BTW, does the fact that the H1 and H3 Stacker look the same, except for H2, make them the same? =P If the H1 Stacker didn't survive the Battle of Installation 04, then who's the Marine Sergeant (not to mention VOICED by the same actor) in Halo 3? It's really a confusing issue. =/ --[[User:Blemo|<span style="color: steelblue; font-family: Arial; font-size: 10pt;">'''Blemo'''</span>]] http://www.wikia.com/skins/common/progress-wheel.gif <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="royalblue">TALK</font>]]</sup> • <sub>  [http://halopedian.com/Special:Contributions/Blemo <font color="lightblue">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]</sub></small> • <sub><small>[http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Halo3/Default.aspx?player=Blemo+23 <font color="teal">SERVICE RECORD</font>]</small></sub> • <sub><small><font color="olivedrab"><span style="font-weight: light;" title="''Loser''. noun -- Anyone that is dumb enough to stare at a message on someone's signature for no apparent reason. You reading this pretty much proves the point.">MESSAGE</span></font></small></sub> 05:30, 1 December 2007 (UTC)

::::: He just got a shave. Is that impossible? His face structure is pretty much the same. [[User:Imperialscouts]]
::::::It's impossible that he could have survived either Halo 1 or Halo 2. It's not impossible that there could be more than one Stacker in the Halo universe.
--[[User:68.44.253.17|68.44.253.17]] 07:32, 13 December 2007 (UTC)
:::::::How is it impossible that he could survive Halo 2? On the last level of Halo 2 you see Johnson, Stacker, and that other sergeant all tied up. When the Brutes notice you, Johnson yells "Go, Go, Go!" and they get up and attack the brutes. They usually survive, even on Legendary. Just check after the cutscene with Johnson and the Scarab. He should be there, off to the left, with a wimpy little plasma pistol. You leave him with your Elite allies. Seeing as The Arbiter, Miranda, and Johnson get off, he should been able to. [[User:Imperialscouts]]

He either Boarded the scarab with Johnson and Banks or stayed be hind with the elites and after the final cutscene of halo 2 Johnson Arbiter and miranda probobly got back in the scarab and picked up all the elite forces (And Stacker and banks)in the area, I mean, why wouldnt they?[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:53, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

== That wasnt Stacker ==

Stacker did not have the IWHBYD line or realy "comand" zulu (he MAY have co-commanded though) that was a Johnson duplicate spawned of pure win... ok maby not but still it waqs a Johnson duplicate dont use him to reason it out[[User:SargeLIVES|SargeLIVES]] 03:29, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

:Hey, Dude, Stacker has that line as well in the Silent Cartographer. Also, on Assualt on the Control Room you get two marine Sergeants that show up. One is Stacker, the other is Johnson (Which is f****ing awesome!) I'm guessing Stacker co-comanded it. Makes sense to me. [[User:Imperialscouts]]
::Actually the Stacker with the sniper rifle doesn't have the "Stacker voice"... lolz --File:MA5C ICWS Assault Rifle.jpg|50px]] ''[[User:Blemo|<span style="color: gray; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10pt;">'''Blemo'''</span>]] File:Progress Wheel.gif]] <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">TALK</font>]]</sup></small> • <sub><small>  [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small>[[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">EMAIL</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small><font color="#A9A9A9"><span style="font-weight: light;" title="''Loser''. noun -- Anyone that is dumb enough to stare at a message on someone's signature for no apparent reason. You reading this pretty much proves the point.">MESSAGE</span></font></small></sub>'' 04:08, 1 January 2008 (UTC)
Really? I never paid close enough attention. On higher difficulties he always died and on lower ones I was in a Tank...I'll have to check on that. [[User:Imperialscouts]]

Well on the Assult on the control room you come accros 2 groups of marines 1 lead by Stacker and the other lead by Johnson (although in halo cannon johnson is on his way to were you go to at 343 Guilty Spark)And there is only 1 short fight Before the get evacuated so pretty much they both commande[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:40, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

== Replace Image ==
Do you think we should replace the infobox image of [[Stacker]] to sumfink else? It looks like he's taking a crap with his Magnum. Plus, we also need an image that shows his face's features as the article says. We wouldn't want to say "he has a scar that runs down the right side of his face and into his goatee" and have an image of him head down, or facing some other direction. --File:MA5C ICWS Assault Rifle.jpg|50px]] ''[[User:Blemo|<span style="color: gray; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10pt;">'''Blemo'''</span>]] File:Progress Wheel.gif]] <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">TALK</font>]]</sup></small> • <sub><small>  [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small>[[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">EMAIL</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small><font color="#A9A9A9"><span style="font-weight: light;" title="''Loser''. noun -- Anyone that is dumb enough to stare at a message on someone's signature for no apparent reason. You reading this pretty much proves the point.">MESSAGE</span></font></small></sub>'' 01:43, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
:Image replaced. --File:MA5C ICWS Assault Rifle.jpg|50px]] ''[[User:Blemo|<span style="color: gray; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10pt;">'''Blemo'''</span>]] File:Progress Wheel.gif]] <small><sup>[[user talk:Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">TALK</font>]]</sup></small> • <sub><small>  [[Special:Contributions/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">CONTRIBUTIONS</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small>[[Special:Emailuser/Blemo|<font color="#A9A9A9">EMAIL</font>]]</small></sub> • <sub><small><font color="#A9A9A9"><span style="font-weight: light;" title="''Loser''. noun -- Anyone that is dumb enough to stare at a message on someone's signature for no apparent reason. You reading this pretty much proves the point.">MESSAGE</span></font></small></sub>'' 04:06, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Well on the Assult on the control room you come accros 2 groups of marines 1 lead by Stacker and the other lead by Johnson (although in halo cannon johnson is on his way to were you go to at 343 Guilty Spark)And there is only 1 short fight Before the get evacuated so pretty much they both commanded

== Different Dudes ==

The Halo 2 Stacker has no scars, so unless he slapped on some scar remover (which, I guess, is actually possible) he is a different guy. I say twin brother.<br />[[User:What's His Face|What&#39;s His Face]]

hes the same[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 18:06, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

:Oh come on, we all know Stacker by his calm, drawling voice. [[User talk:Rebel grunt|Rebel grunt]]

HES THE SAME!!!!![[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:42, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

== How do we... ==

How do we know that Stacker was in all those battles? I thought that the only time he was mentioned was in Halo: The Flood, which would put him on Installation 04 at the time of detonation, most likely, killing him. Is he ever mentioned after that? If not, all those people who look like him could be just that: people that look like him. Chiafriend12 22:42, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Yeah People that Look like him have the same name, same rank, same voice, same eye color, same hair color, And pretty much same face apart from a scar and a beard (have u ever heard of a shave????)[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:45, November 1, 2009 (UTC) 

What if Stacker got off in some kind of small ship (Longsword/Pelican maybe) with some other dudes (like Chips) and then waited with a reasonable food supply of some sort? Or they camped out on Basis or a station on Threshold?
And then maybe ONI dispatched a prowler to the scene (before High Charity arrived in Halo 2) and happened to pick them up? [[User talk:Sgtpickle777|Sgtpickle777]] 02:41, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

Yeah Chief made it back alright in a longsword Why cant Pete Stacke Chips Dubbo And Thomas Chang make it[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:48, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

Im Sure its the same guy in all 3 games because (I)The voice is the same (II) They All have the same facial features (Apart fro the halo 2 stacker which had a Shave and used some scar remover)(III) They have the same lines Eg- "Anyone got some airplugs?"(in halo 2&3) "Okay, I admit it, That hurt!"  (Also in halo 2&3)(IIII)The Halo 3 Stacker looks older Then in Halo CE and 2. Beat That [[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 05:30, November 1, 2009 (UTC)Gunnery Sergeant Stacker

== Holy Arrow...? ==
Do we have a source for that being how he got off Alpha Halo? And who's Fire Team Romeo? If not, it should be deleted. [[User:SPARTAN-019|SPARTAN-019]] 21:35, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

== he uses the AR en route to Voi ==

Stacker, when muttering to chief, "we were en route to Voi, Chief. Banshies started strafing...pretty much ruined our day..." he is found inside or close to the bunker on the right. He is using an AR.

I know its disgraceful that he would do that, I mean Pete how could you?[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 06:16, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

:Clearly Gunnery Sergeant Stacker thinks the Battle Rifle is overpowered, and prefers the good ole' MA5C. ^_^ -- <b>[[Halopedia:Administrators|<font color=indigo>Administrator</font>]] [[User:Specops306|<font color=indigo>Specops306</font>]]</b> - <i><b><u>[[User Talk:Specops306|<font color=blue>Qur'a 'Morhek</font>]]</u></b></i> 06:51, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

How come on every other level he uses it? it is clearly his favorite weapon and the halo 3 MA5C sucks balls the halo 1 MA5B is way better[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:33, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

Pete isint that dumb to like the MA5C[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:34, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

Dude, he was making a joke. I did prefer the MA5B to the MA5C and the BR to both.[[User talk:JimMy pAz Br07|JimMy pAz Br07]] 09:56, May 12, 2010 (UTC)

== Quotes ==

The link to his quotes is gone. [[User:Bioniclepluslotr|<span style="color: lime; font-family: BankGothic Md BT; font-size: 12pt;">'''BPL'''</span>]] 23:48, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Somebody posted the quote: "get ready to bring out the elephant guns" however the actual quote is "Its a scarab bring out the elephant guns boys" so I changed it,          Then someone changed it back then I changed it back so if that person is out there please get your facts right........[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 07:10, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

== American? ==

Should the article mention that he is an American?  I'm basing this on one of his lines from Halo 3 when you haven't moved for a while, "This is not where the American idles." His accent is clearly indicative of a Southern-state upbringing, and his attitude is just plain Texan. [[User talk:Flag-Waving American Patriot|Flag-Waving American Patriot]] 18:18, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

== Name? ==

Where did his name come from? I thought characters like Stacker were just sergeant models are not actual characters. [[Special:Contributions/173.79.185.96|173.79.185.96]] 21:38, October 30, 2009 (UTC)

== IWHBYD ==

In halo combat evolved stacker DID have the IWHBYD line as well as Johnson but Stacker said it like "I would have been your daddy but THEN a dog beat me over the fence" And Johnson Didnt say then, Im 100% Sure i play CE all the time

== Breach of protocol ==

On cairo station i was at the bit were you first meet miranda keyes and johnson taunted the enemy "Come out here split lip!"
and stacker said to johnson "I hope you aint all talk marine" johnson replied "Sir yes sir" When Johnson is a higher rank then stacker lol[[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 06:25, November 1, 2009 (UTC)

:The two soildiers with Keyes in that level are Navel personal, possibly officers, probably members of In Amber Clads bridge crew. Thus they would outrank Johnson.--'''<span style="background:Brown;display:inline-block;height:16px;padding-right:4px;line-height:1em;position:relative;top:-3px;-moz-border-radius:0 50% 50%">[[User:Arabsbananas|<font color="White">CR8ZY-ArAB</font>]]</span>''' 18:16, November 11, 2009 (UTC)

Accually they are sergeants Stacker and Banks, in their uniforms but on that level, every marine in service uniforms have majour signas on there uniform, they also all have the purple heart. its a mistake by bungie.

== IWHBYD!!!!! EVERYONE HAS TO READ THIS ==

On the halo 3 legendary edition if you listen to the commentaries Marty O'Donnel clearly states that the IWHBYD line is acually Stackers! not johnsons! 
Halopedia has been wrong all along!!!![[User talk:Gunnery Sargeant Stacker|Gunnery Sargeant Stacker]] 11:08, January 8, 2010 (UTC) 
 
== Picture ==
Can we update Stacker's picture with a Reach generation picture? It would seem appropriate since Stacker is either in Reach or just a FF voice.
:There's absolutely no proof that they are the same character. Until it is confirmed, leave it as the Halo 3- Stacker.--[[User talk:TDSpiral94|TDSpiral94]] 10:27, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

== Reach ==

Stackers definately making an appearance in Halo: Reach. His Firefight image is a completely new model while Johnson, Buck etc all have their Halo 3 images--[[User talk:Soul reaper|Soul reaper]] 07:24, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

== Stock marines and biographies ==

Can we really regard Stacker and Dubbo as actual characters with canonical biographies? They're definitely among the most iconic allies in the games, but trying to create a canon backstory for characters who exist in many places at the same time or can die multiple times during gameplay becomes problematic. Johnson used to be one of the "stock marines" in ''Combat Evolved'', but he was made a proper character in ''First Strike''; Stacker and Dubbo never received the same treatment. The variable character models also raise inconsistencies; the article talks about Stacker being an ODST, despite the fact we see him in normal Marine BDU numerous times. Not to mention the specifics of their escape from Installation 04, or their simultaneous presence in Mombasa and ''In Amber Clad''. --[[User:Jugus|<font color="MidnightBlue"><b>Jugus</b></font>]] <small>([[User talk:Jugus|<font color="Gray">Talk</font>]] | [[Special:Contributions/Jugus|<font color="Gray">Contribs</font>]])</small> 03:20, 28 August 2011 (EDT)

:I've always regarded Stacker and Dubbo this way, as well. I believe that the ''real'' Pete Stacker and the ''real'' Chips Dubbo both died on Installation 04. As I recall, no source has stated that the sergeant featured in ''Outskirts'', ''Another Day at the Beach'', and the rest of ''Halo 2'' is the character featured in ''Combat Evolved''; this is extremely unlikely, especially considering that he looks ''nothing'' like Marcus Lehto, on whom Sergeant Stacker's face is quite clearly modeled. Though his ''Halo 3''/''ODST'' model is an updated version of his ''Combat Evolved'' model, there is still no proof that they are the same character. He even wears an Army BDU in his Firefight portrait, and resembles the "Stacker" NPC from ''Halo 2''.

:In ''Combat Evolved'', Pete Stacker - the voice actor, of course - isn't even credited as the sergeant, only for his role as Captain Keyes. In ''Halo 2'', he is credited as "Sergeant Stacker"; in ''Halo 3'', he is credited as "Sergeant"; in ODST, he is credited as "Marine". In ''Reach'', he is credited as <u>TROOPER</u> SGT 1; like I mentioned earlier, he's portrayed as a member of the Army in ''Reach''. There is clearly no sense of continuity with Stacker's portrayal.

:Whereas the Bungie guys have expressed their admiration for Gunnery Sergeant Stacker several times, such as in the ''Reach Legendary Edition'' commentary and during the panel from ''Halofest'' on Friday, they've rarely mentioned Dubbo. As I recall, the commentators on the ''Halo 3: Essentials'' disc say something along the lines of ''"Yeah, the Aussie,"'' when Dubbo shows up during one of the cutscenes. That's it. They've never really given him much attention beyond that. Andrew McKaige is credited as Dubbo only in ''Combat Evolved'' and ''Halo 2''; in ''Halo 3'' and ''ODST'', he is credited simply as "Marine".

:I have never regarded Dubbo and Stacker as ''true'' characters with any real significance to canon, aside from their appearances in ''Combat Evolved''. I have always felt that Bungie wanted a set of NPCs with the same "spirit", if you will, to appear throughout the series; this is especially evident when you consider the NMPD sergeant at Alpha Site. I don't think they intended for these characters to actually exist, especially not as Marines, ODSTs, ''and'' Army troopers. --[[User talk:Braidenvl|Courage never dies.]] 09:40, 28 August 2011 (EDT)

::I have reconsidered what I said earlier. Aside from Bungie's semi-frequent references to the Stacker/Lehto NPC, not the actual character, Sergeant Stacker is identified as such only in ''Halo 2'''s credits. The "Stacker" NPC from ''Combat Evolved'' actually represents Gunnery Sergeant Waller and a few other separate characters. The ''real'' Sergeant Stacker appears only in ''Halo 2''/''Another Day at the Beach'', as he is the only one who is identified as such. The "Stackers" seen in ''Combat Evolved'', ''Halo 3'', and ''Reach'' are simply NPCs with the same voice actor and the same personality.

::Furthermore, Stacker has never officially been referred to as a staff sergeant; he is called "Sergeant" in ''Another Day at the Beach'' and ''Halo 2'''s credits. He is also never called "Pete". While it is reasonable that his first name is Pete, as that is his voice actor's name, there is no proof of this. This article, as well as Chips Dubbo's, is in great need of an overhaul. --[[User talk:Braidenvl|Courage never dies.]] 14:50, 28 August 2011 (EDT)

:As mentioned in the article, their canonical status is in limbo. They're not meant to be taken seriously. The reason they keep undying and reappearing in the most unlikely of places is because they're funny. I'm sure that, somewhere in the universe, there is ''the'' Stacker and ''the'' Dubbo, who are present as characters to some extent; perhaps one of the many clones encountered in the games is the real character, somewhere. I suppose if 343i ever got around to doing anything with them, they could give the "one big identical family" explanation, where ''Halo: CE'' Stacker is the older brother of ''Halo 2'' Stacker and so on, probably the only explanation they could give without making some major retcons. I think the articles should keep doing what they're doing and acknowledge their semi-canon status by recording their many often contradictory appearances as consistently as possible. -  [[User:Halo-343|<span style="color: purple; font-family: Times New Roman; font-size: 128%;">'''Halo-343'''</span>]] [[User talk:Halo-343|<font color="green">('''Talk''')</font>]] 17:18, 28 August 2011 (EDT)

==Battle of Installation 04==
I think this was discussed somewhere already, but really, did Stacker really fought at the T&R as well as the Silent Cartographer? His appearance was substituted by Waller and Parker in ''The Flood'', so, really, his only appearance would be in Assault on the Control Room, and the novel didn't go in-depth in that part of the game. Can we remove his participation in T&R and SC?{{Unsigned|Spartan331}}
:Yeah it would make more sense, though I'd really wish that someone would clarify how he escaped the ring.--{{User:Spartacus/Sig}}

== Halo 4 ==

Stacker appears as a Master Sergeant on a ''Halo 4'' mission, although currently I'm forgetting which one it was. [[Special:Contributions/76.105.110.9|76.105.110.9]] 16:15, 7 November 2012 (EST)

I just saw a walkthrough of the Reclaimer mission, no mention was made of his rank or name, though he was identified as "Sergeant Stacker" in subtitles. Anybody know any other levels he shows up in?--[[Special:Contributions/64.9.54.31|64.9.54.31]] 22:23, 11 November 2012 (EST)
:Unfortunately, no; [[Reclaimer (level)|Reclaimer]] is the only one. Maybe he'll make a cameo in Spartan Ops. --[[User talk:Dr Mutran|Dr Mutran]] 22:51, 11 November 2012 (EST)

:No the only level he's in is Reclaimer.[[User:Spartansniper450/IRC Quotes|<span style="color:#000000">''Col.''</span>]] [[User:Spartansniper450|<span style="color:#00416A">Snipes</span>]][[User talk:Spartansniper450|<span style="color:gold">4</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Spartansniper450|<span style="color:silver">50</span>]] 22:55, 11 November 2012 (EST)

:Does his name and rank come from the credits, then? Again, he's only identified as "Sgt Stacker" in subtitles.--[[Special:Contributions/64.9.59.19|64.9.59.19]] 12:08, 12 November 2012 (EST)

::His full name and rank are mentioned in the incoming transmission box in the upper left-hand corner of the screen, as with other characters. --[[User:Jugus|<font color="MidnightBlue"><b>Jugus</b></font>]] <small>([[User talk:Jugus|<font color="Gray">Talk</font>]] | [[Special:Contributions/Jugus|<font color="Gray">Contribs</font>]])</small> 12:14, 12 November 2012 (EST)

== Clearing up some stuff. ==

Okay this bugs me. Pete Stacker was NOT present for the Assault on the Control room. Fireteam Zulu is led by a dark skinned Sargent now known NOT to be Johnson. The second squad encountered on this level is a Marine who looks like stacker but has a different voice every single time. He was definately NOT there. He WAS however present for the evacuation of the flood containment facility because when corporal lovik approaches the chief as he ascends the elevator, the sargent amongst the men is 9 times out of 10, Stacker.

Play halo CE and see for yourself.

My experience as a Halo CE modder and devout.

[[User:Sociowrath|Sociowrath]] ([[User talk:Sociowrath|talk]]) 00:08, 17 May 2016 (EDT)

== Regarding Marcus P. Stacker's Canon Status throughout the games ==

'''Halo CE:'''

- A Marine Sergeant model, who may or may not spawn with Pete Stacker's voice, can spawn throughout Halo CE, however, it only has scripted dialogue (which is also voiced by Pete Stacker) in one place (which is also it's only guaranteed spawn):

- The Marine Sergeant in ''Silent Cartographer'', who as of Halo The Flood: is canonically Gunnery Sergeant Waller. All but one of the scripted lines from Halo CE's Marine Sergeant are spoken by Waller in the book. One line isn't, but at this point it's impossible for another Marine Sergeant to be present, as it's not portrayed in either Halo CE nor the book.

- Bungie have referred to this Marine Sergeant ''informally'' as "Sergeant Stacker" notably in the developer commentaries and Marcus Leto's twitter, however we have no reason to believe this isn't purely referring to the voice actor.

'''Halo 2'''

- In early development, Pete Stacker was intended to voice a "Sergeant Banks" (can be seen in the E3 Demo) while Orlando Jones would voice a "Sergeant Jones".

- In the final Halo 2, Pete Stacker voiced a "Sergeant Stacker", nicknamed by bungie as "Sergeant Gruff" The "Sergeant Stacker" name appears in two places that can be considered in-universe, the credits, and during the ViDoc displaying the making of ADatB, where the cast's in-universe names are all displayed.

- Stacker appears 100% of the time as an ODST on *Delta Halo*, and also appears as an ODST in ADatB. This, especially the latter, is decisive evidence Stacker is an ODST.

'''Halo 3'''

- In Halo 3, Pete Stacker voiced "Marine Sergeant" who was never named. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence for this being the same Stacker from Halo 2, such as Stacker serving under Johnson and Keyes as he did in Halo 2, and the same voice, and spawning as an ODST in ''The Covenant.'', even arguably being somewhat casual and familiar with John-117 and 343 Guilty Spark. However there was no decisive evidence that this Marine Sergeant is Stacker.

- This Sergeant often exchanges places with Gunnery Sergeant Reynolds, which could be an indication of his rank, however there is still no decisive evidence this Marine Sergeant is a Gunnery Sergeant.

'''Halo Reach'''

-"Gunnery Sergeant Stacker" appears in the Armory as a Firefight voice, with a new appearance more akid to his Halo 2 look (darker skin and hair, and no scar) than his Halo 3 one (pale skin, light hair, scar) He's also wearing Halo Reach Army Trooper Armor, suggesting he would appear in the campaign, as all Halo 3 characters had their Halo 3 appearances, such as Johnson, Buck etc.

-Pete Stacker is credited for voicing "Trooper SGT 1" (Trooper_sgt1 in the game files) A Trooper spawns with the Trooper_sgt1 voice file in the level Exodus, and delivers the scripted lines of "Kilo-40" which are also voiced by Pete Stacker. Pete Stacker is not given separate credit for Gunnery Sergeant Stacker's firefight voice OR Kilo-40. Interestingly, giving a generic Trooper the "Trooper_sgt1" voice file results in a trooper with Gunnery Sergeant Stacker's firefight combat dialogue as his dynamic combat dialogue.

- Gunnery Sergeant Stacker's firefight voice has a quote from the Halo 3 Marine Sergeant as it's description in the Armory.

'''Halo 4'''

Master Sergeant Marcus P. Stacker, who is voiced by Pete Stacker and who's dialogue is a clear reference to the Halo 3 Marine Sergeant's dialogue in The Ark.

'''Conclusion'''

The above is, I believe, enough to establish that:

-Kilo-40 from Reach

-Gunnery Sergeant Stacker from Reach's armory

-Sergeant Stacker from Halo 2, ADatB

-Marine Sergeant from Halo 3

-Master Sergeant Marcus P. Stacker from Halo 4

are one distinct canonical character. This article displays this currently.

'''Proposal'''

There is no evidence that this character (which is at a minimum, Gunnery Sergeant Stacker from Reach's armory, Sergeant Stacker from Halo 2, and Master Sergeant Marcus P. Stacker from Halo 4) has any in-universe connection whatsoever to the Marine Sergeant in Halo CE, and the Installation 04 section should be removed from this article's biography section and instead documented in a Trivia/Notes/Misc section.

[[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 23:41, March 25, 2020 (EDT)

:''[[Talk:Marcus Stacker#Stock marines and biographies|I think the articles should keep doing what they're doing and acknowledge their semi-canon status by recording their many often contradictory appearances as consistently as possible - Final discussion point from this exact discussion page.]]''

:Before the ''Halo: The Flood'' was released, we would treat every appearance of Stacker in Halo: CE as evidence of his presence in Battle of Installation 04. Unless proven otherwise (i.e. like the case of Waller), they are all evidence that Stacker took part in the Battle of Installation 04 in some extent. 

:You brought up evidence of Stacker's appearance in every game. However, there's no evidence that CE Stacker ''was not'' the same character from the later games. We ''do'' have evidence they are the same character by the rule of Occam's Razor: If "CE Stacker" talks like the other Stackers, acts like the other Stackers, has the same name as the other Stackers, the simplest explanation is that they are the same person. Waller's dialogue has proved that Stacker's "presence" in the level ''The Silent Cartographer'' was not canon. But until we have '''explicit''' evidence that Stacker was not present in Installation 04 (or that he's not the same Stacker from the later games), we would treat every evidence of his appearance in Halo: CE as evidence that he is the same Stacker, and he had participated in the battle. I can't support this proposal. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 00:42, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:: Respectfully, the comment you linked is from 2011, pre-Halo 4. We didn't have enough evidence to consider Stacker a canonical character then, we do now. Marcus P Stacker is no longer "semi-canon", he's an established individual that exists in the Halo universe.

::You mention "CE Stacker" yet as detailed in the original post, there is absolutely zero in-universe sources connecting the Halo CE Marine Sergeant to that name. And that Marine Sergeant has '''one''' scripted appearance in CE anyway, which we know is Waller. The other three times where that Marine Sergeant can spawn, it is neither guaranteed, nor does it have any scripted dialogue, nor is the Sergeant model even guaranteed to *have* Pete Stacker's voice.

::"If ''Marine Sergeant'' talks like the other Stackers" - he doesn't always, as already mentioned. 

::"acts like the other Stackers" - We don't consider the NMPD Sergeant an appearance of Marcus Stacker, nor Echo-Four, nor the Marine Sergeant that spawns on Kizingo Boulevard.

::"has the same name as the other Stackers" - he doesn't '''have''' a name in Halo CE.

:: "until we have '''explicit''' evidence that Stacker was not present in Installation 04, we would treat every evidence of his appearance in Halo: CE as evidence that he is the same Stacker had participated in the battle." - I'm sorry, but '''we don't even have any evidence that Stacker was present on Installation 04 in the first place'''. True Negatives are prefarable to False positives anyway, so with the information we have (ie, none at all), Marcus Stacker should '''NOT''' be stated to have participated in the battle. [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 02:12, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::We don't just use in-universe sources. [http://halo.bungie.net/projects/halo/asset_thumb_viewer.aspx?cc=25&at=56&page=1 Here's your proof of '''Sgt. Stacker''' being the name of the Marine Sergeant in Halo: CE.] Nine outtakes videos titled "Pete Stacker (voice of Sgt. Stacker) Outtake", with similarly-named videos for other characters. All of them have same name layouts where the voice actors were attributed to the characters names. Unless the information on this page has been contradicted by a later source (i.e. the '''''named appearance''''' of this Stacker in levels ''Halo'' and ''Assault on the Control Room'' being substituted by characters like Waller or Parker), it remains canon.

:::''"he doesn't always, as already mentioned."'' - As far as I am concerned, we don't ''judge'' what is canon or not canon. '''By judging the possibility of his absence as evidence of his absence, we are judging his possible named appearances as not canon'''. We don't judge. We ''present'' all information from a canon source, and if there are any conflicts between sources, we present the most possible explanation. We cannot state that a character or event did not canonically appear in a game simply because they might not have a ''guaranteed'' appearance (i.e. spawn with the "correct" appearance and voice). Just by having a chance that he could appear with the the correct combination (i.e. face and voice) in a playthrough of a level (i.e. ''Halo'' and ''Assault on the Control Room''), it is sufficient evidence that this character was canonically present during the events of that level (scripted dialogue only serves as additional and very much confirmatory evidence of their presence), unless proven otherwise (i.e. case of Waller). We wouldn't void the canonical appearance of the various Marines/troopers from the random side objectives in the ''New Alexandria'' level, why should we do it here?

:::''"We don't consider the NMPD Sergeant an appearance of Marcus Stacker, nor Echo-Four, nor the Marine Sergeant that spawns on Kizingo Boulevard."'' - Point is moot because those characters weren't named Stacker, whereas CE Stacker was '''explicitly''' named Stacker by Bungie.

:::''"he doesn't '''have''' a name in Halo CE."'' - Point is moot. He does have a name, you simply didn't do enough research.

:::''"we don't even have any evidence that Stacker was present on Installation 04 in the first place"'' - Yes we do. The CE character was named Stacker by Bungie, and since it is possible for this Stacker to appear (with his voice and face) in two campaign levels, we have evidence that Stacker was present on Installation 04.

:::The decision to ''judge his possible appearances as non-canon'' has huge implications in our Canon policy and how we present canon information we get from games. It cannot be taken so lightly, because it would affect how we extract canon information from gameplay. I know this was based on a conversations on Discord, and we need to hear opinions from other members. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 05:35, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::: Of course we don't only use in-universe sources, I never implied that. And I would hold that the source you linked isn't evidence to suggest any in-universe name is intended, rather just nicknaming him after his Voice Actor. "Voice of the Grunt" and "Voice of Sarge" don't exactly indicate a strict format to those outtake labels. Here's an incredibly similar source where a Bungie employee refers to Sergeant Banks as "Sergeant Jones" for example despite calling other characters by their in-universe names: http://nikon.bungie.org/misc/voices.html

:::: This isn't judging what is or what is nor canon. This is simply avoiding stating things that we aren't certain of. If we don't have enough evidence to believe something happened, we can't detail it. This is why we stick to scripted events and dialogue. There is simply not enough evidence to suggest that Halo CE's Marine Sergeant is a distinct canonical character '''at all''', let alone Marcus Stacker. If you exclude ''The Silent Chartographer'', he is scripted to spawn a total of '''Zero''' times across the entire game, his other three appearances are completely random. Even upon spawning, he does not always have a consistent voice. And his face bitmap is not unique, the "Marcus" bitmap can be found on regular, helmeted marines as well.

::::Character biographies should be written from an in-universe perspective. This is why we avoid specific gameplay-related details and screenshots for example. We can detail the possibility of a Marine Sergeant on Installation-04 possibly being Stacker in misc and/or trivia sections the same way his appearance in Halo 3: ODST is handled.

:::: Again, the CE Marine Sergeant has never been referred to as "Stacker" in an in-universe context, or in credits. http://nikon.bungie.org/misc/voices.html if you read the Halo CE voices listed here, you'll find Marty attributing Pete Stacker to the following in CE: 

::::Pete Stacker: Keyes and Sarge2 - the one who says - "I would have been your daddy ... (fill in the rest if you're a true fan)" 

::::You'll also find nothing but Sarge2 in the gamefiles. [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 07:20, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::::”And I would hold that the source you linked isn't evidence to suggest any in-universe name is intended, rather just nicknaming him after his Voice Actor.” - Except you shouldn’t, because all of the other video have names which tied the ‘’’established names’’’ of in-universe characters to their voice actors (Cortana to Jen Taylor, McKaige to Dubbo, Wicklund to Jenkins, Diaz to Mendoza). In fact, this might be the only place where Wicklund is credited for playing Jenkins. You are saying that information (which also contains ‘’working titles/names’’, as in not-yet finalised names for characters who haven’t been named in 2001, such as [[Samuel Marcus]] as “Cryp Tech”) posted on HBO by a Bungie employee in 2001 cannot be overwritten by information (most rote recently updated ones) on Bungie.net, posted by a Bungie employee in 2007. That’s ridiculous.

:::::Your entire argument hinges on the fact that CE Stacker wasn’t named in the game files or dialogue. Except isn’t the first time we have had in-game characters named retroactively outside of the retail game: [[Parker]], [[Waller]], [[Zuka Zamamee]], [[Ardo 'Moretumee]], [[Thrallslayer]], [[Cethegus]]. And once again, just because the perfect Stacker (correct face and appearance) can’t spawn on some play through, doesn’t mean we can ignore the cases where the perfect Stacker ‘’does’’ spawn (this making a canon appearance).

:::::I think we’ve both made our cases. I’ll go ahead and make it a proper vote and proposal. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 09:07, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

==Vote for Keeping Stacker’s Canon Involvement in Battle of Installation 04==

Per the discussion above. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 09:07, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

===Support===
*{{Support}} - Although his scripted appearance in one campaign level was replaced by Waller, Stacker could still randomly appear (with his distinct appearance and voice) in the campaign levels “Halo” and “Assault in the Control Room”. Given this Stacker was named in 2007 on Bungie.net as “Sgt. Stacker”, and he appears in the two aforementioned campaign levels, his appearances serve as evidence for his involvement in the Battle of Installation 04. For more detail analysis, do check both sides of the argument above.—<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 09:07, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

*{{Support}} [[User:Editorguy|Editorguy]] ([[User talk:Editorguy|talk]]) 18:01, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

*{{Support}} Given Bungie clearly intend it to be the same character (dubious canonicity/ easter egg status and all). This support is with the proviso that we just dubcanon the section regarding Installation 04, and add a production notes section explaining everything. Any "Unnamed marine sergeant" page that may hypothetically be made I wouldn't class as noteworthy enough for a full page IMO, so I'd rather keep the info here. But once again this is with the assumption we add a Semi-canon notice to the relevant information. I'd rather just give the reader ''all'' of the information, properly explain it all then let them decide what approach makes sense. [[User:BaconShelf|BaconShelf]] ([[User talk:BaconShelf|talk]]) 19:02, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

::Absolutely. The info has to be mentioned here. Just not unambiguously in the biography section.[[User:TheEld|TheEld]] ([[User talk:TheEld|talk]]) 19:24, March 26, 2020 (EDT)TheEld

:: Part of my argument is that the CE Marine Sergeant doesn't even have a strong case to be considered an individual character in his own right. He already represents two other Marines as well as his (hypothetical) self. I find it incredibly dubious that it was ever intended to represent one in-universe character. Even ''before'' The Flood, this guy is scripted to die in Silent Chartographer. To be clear, my proposal would still give the reader all information, just not in the in-universe Biography section. [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 19:31, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

*{{Support}} I have a few comments further below that illustrate my support. -[[User:ScaleMaster117|ScaleMaster117]] ([[User talk:ScaleMaster117|talk]]) 10:30, March 29, 2020 (EDT)

===Neutral===
*{{Neutral}} We could go the route where we move all the cases where its impossible for Stacker being at a local on I04 into its own area on the page. Explaining what he does and how he was replaced in said media. Kinda better than outright killing the info but also following what the oppose people are suggesting.-[[User:CIA391|CIA391]] ([[User talk:CIA391|talk]]) 10:29, March 29, 2020 (EDT)

===Oppose===
*{{Oppose}} Whether or not there was some random guy named Stacker present on Alpha Halo is irrelevent. We know this cannot be the same person as the character in ''Halo 2''. Retroactively naming the marine Pete Stacker voiced in ''Combat Evolved'' makes the appearances in that game at best Easter eggs akin to the Grunt you can talk to at the end of ''Halo 3''. The biggest problem I see here is the way people are treating ''Combat Evolved''. We don't have to dither over which aspects of gameplay and level design are canon (*cough* end Warthog run *cough*) because we have ''[[Halo: The Flood]]'' to give us the definitive version of events as they canonically happened. [[User:TheEld|TheEld]] ([[User talk:TheEld|talk]]) 16:05, March 26, 2020 (EDT)TheEld

::The case of Warthog Run isn’t a good comparison here though. We don’t consider the length of PoA based on the the Warthog Run - a “canon” information from gameplay - because it contradicts with other established sources. Stacker’s involvement in the Battle of Installation 04 (per his appearances in “Halo” and “Assault on the Control Room”) - a canon information from gameplay - was not contradicted by other sources. Unless we have more information on the marines who participated in the events of those two levels, we can’t ignore the fact that CE Stacker had made an appearance in CE and thus participated in the Battle of Installation 04.—<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 20:20, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

*{{Oppose}} To be perfectly candid, I like the notion of Stacker having been at Installation 04, and I would like it if it were to be established as canonical fact in future. However, as it currently stands, we don't actually have any canonical evidence linking Sergeant Marcus Stacker to any of the appearances, scripted or otherwise, of Pete Stacker's Sergeant in ''Halo: CE''. In fact, ''Halo: The Flood'' gives a different name to the only scripted appearance (that I'm aware of) of the Sergeant he voices - Waller. We can concretely identify the Marine who leads John to Keyes on the Pillar of Autumn as Chips Dubbo because the CE credits call him that, and ''The Flood'' doesn't overwrite it. However, in Stacker's case, nothing concrete has ever linked him to the events in ''CE'', and even if it had, it's since been overwritten by ''The Flood''. In short, we cannot conclude that he was at Installation 04 at this time. {{User:Dab1001/Sig2}} 17:56, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

::”Halo: The Flood” doesn’t overwrite the appearances he makes in the campaign levels “Halo” and “Assault on the Control Room”. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 20:20, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

::: The CE Sergeant spawn on ''Halo'' isn't guaranteed, and has no scripted dialogue. The CE Sergeant spawn on ''Assault on the Control Room'' isn't guaranteed, isn't voiced by Pete Stacker, and has no scripted dialogue. [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 22:05, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::: As I've mentioned before, canon involvement shouldn't be based solely on guaranteed spawn of the perfect appearance and scripted dialogue. Whilst those serve as very solid evidence of their appearance with specific actions at a specific event, random spawns are still very much evidence for their involvement and presence in the event. There's a hierarchy of evidence in all of this: scripted dialogue (e.g. pretty much every scripted dialogue from Dubbo, who changes his appearance a lot, but scripted dialogue confirms his appearance), named appearance (e.g. Reynolds in ''Sierra 117''), and possible appearances (e.g. Banks in ''Regret'', random marines/troopers in ''New Alexandria'' side objectives). Unless these possible appearances are overwritten by other sources, they stand as solid evidence for the existence and presence of these characters during the fictional events. To what extent? We don't know. But we can't judge these evidence as "not canon" simply because sometimes the computer's randomness didn't perfectly produce the appearance. —<span style="font-family: Eurostile;">'''[[User:Spartan331|<span style="color:#000;">SPARTAN</span>]][[User talk:Spartan331|<span style="color:#888;">331</span>]]'''</span> 03:47, March 27, 2020 (EDT)
::::: That's your opinion, and I'm sorry but I disagree. While our gameplay-focused sections like level transcripts or character production notes should represent what is possible in-game, out in-universe character biographies should only include what is concrete. There is something quite dishonest about making something out of nothing. If Bungie intended for Banks for example to canonically be involved in the Regret Mission, then he would spawn there every time. He doesn't, and that makes sense, as he would have been aboard In Amber Clad at that time en route to his later appearances in Halo 2. To use the possibility of him spawning there as decisive evidence of his involvement, (which is exactly what you're doing for Stacker here) would be unreasonable. I also am not seeing how Reynolds has anything do to with what you're saying, as in his "named appearance" he also spawns with the correct model and voice 100% of the time, and has multiple lines of scripted dialogue, none of which applies to the Sarge2 model in AotCR.[[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 16:31, March 27, 2020 (EDT)

::::: I also disagree with: "we can't judge these evidence as "not canon" simply because sometimes the computer's randomness didn't perfectly produce the appearance." Of course we can. The spawns in the Halo games are '''manually programmed''', it's not some mystery. If a spawn in the Halo games is random, '''It's because it was programmed to be random.''' And if a character is programmed to be able to randomly appear, stating unambiguously that the character '''appeared''' is inaccurate and misleading. Hence the argument for Stacker's potential involvement in the Battle of Installation 04 to be moved out of his biography.[[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 16:31, March 27, 2020 (EDT)

*{{oppose}} For reasons outlined in OP. We don't even have enough evidence to consider CE's Sarge2 a single in-universe character. He already represents two other characters in his scripted ''The Silent Cartographer'' appearance and his possible ''Assault on the Control Room'' appearance. Even pre-Halo: The Flood, he is scripted to die during the Silent Cartographer mission. To claim that Marcus P. Stacker from the later games appeared in Halo CE would be at risk of making a False Positive. Avoiding a definitive claim as to his appearance risks a True Negative, which is preferable. [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 18:04, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

*{{Oppose}} The reasoning outlined withing the OP is enough to back the claim that Marcus Stacker wasn't in CE but is fully canon due to appearances within Reach as a Firefight voice for the player during game play. He was placed within New Alexandria to fight and support evacuation efforts this makes the theory of him being able to board the Pillar of Autumn dubious at best due to his primary order to mass evacuate civilians. His canonicity is confirmed via Halo 4 and via Reach. The Marine Sergeants model being informally mentioned as Sergeant Stacker is not viable evidence to connect it to Marcus Stacker, they refer to other characters within the games by the surname of the voice actor frequently. The Marine Sergeant model who may or may not spawn with Stacker's voice within ''Halo: Combat Evolved'' should be considered a purely gameplay character, as his only lines are dynamic combat dialogue. If that were to be taken as canon, the wiki would need thousands of more pages for marines with the same voice actors who are clearly not intended to be canon characters. The existence of Gunnery Sergeant Waller in  ''Halo The Flood'' is enough to show that the CE Sergeant wasn't considered one canon character by bungie. With Bungie's addition of Gunnery Sergeant Stacker to Reach, it's much more likely Marcus Stacker was headed to Earth after finishing the evacuations on Reach, and never aboard the Pillar of Autumn.[[User:Cryingdeath x|Cryingdeath x]] ([[User talk:Cryingdeath x|talk]]) 21:34, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

::Seeing this a bit late but the Halo CE Joyride figure packaging also shows the game's character model on the back of the package with the name "Sergeant Stacker", so that's more or less an explicit reference that was around while the first game was the only thing going. -[[User:ScaleMaster117|ScaleMaster117]] ([[User talk:ScaleMaster117|talk]]) 22:37, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::Hmmm just so its on record. [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/258355019781242883/692928161121304686/unknown.png Here] is the thing in question.-[[User:CIA391|CIA391]] ([[User talk:CIA391|talk]]) 22:55, March 26, 2020 (EDT)

:::: I maintain that it's most likely referring to the gameplay model only. The model depicted is ''scripted''  to die in ''The Silent Cartographer'' yet still has a chance to appear in later missions. It even has a different voice if it spawns on ''Assault on the Control Room''. Would you agree that Bungie didn't intend for the "Sergeant Stacker" model to represent a single in-universe character, but multiple different people ScaleMaster117? [[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 23:34, March 26, 2020 (EDT)
:::::Yes, the pic above is the figure packaging I meant...you found it before I could dig out mine. In my opinion, I think even Sgt. Johnson was almost as much a throwaway 'character' in the sense that Bungie had no idea the game/franchise would become the hit that it did. Johnson was able to be 'killed' as well in various missions. I would think (and the evidence seems to show) that as Johnson became a beloved character, so too did Stacker. The action figure pretty definitively links the game model's face with the plastic sculpt. And Pete Stacker is the voice and namesake for the character. It's all pretty well linked for me. What has to be done though is the realization that the Marines are vulnerable NPCs in Halo 1. (Even Captain Keyes could be killed as we all know, yet story-wise that's not supposed to happen by the player.) It wasn't until Halo 2 that they made characters invulnerable. In Halo 2 game code, Miranda and Johnson had a weight attribute of 10,000 whereas the Chief was something like 150 and Marines were 70 or 75....I'd have to see if the program would fire up to verify, I'm going from memory, but I think the 10,000 value meant the character was incapable of being killed by player (or NPC) weapons fire. This was not the case in Halo 1. Long story short, my opinion is that we should be looking at Sgt. Stacker as an individual character in Halo 1 who was not killed (in the fiction) even if he could be killed via the game's mechanics. -[[User:ScaleMaster117|ScaleMaster117]] ([[User talk:ScaleMaster117|talk]]) 11:37, March 28, 2020 (EDT)

:::::: That's the very thing though, it's not just that "he could be killed via the game's mechanics." Marines in Silent Chartographer are killed off through dialogue and a kill script, ie the game goes out of it's way to kill them, in both the gameplay and the narrative. It seems quite a lot different to me Johnson being able to die in gameplay.[[User:JiMMyPaZ|JiMMyPaZ]] ([[User talk:JiMMyPaZ|talk]]) 04:26, March 29, 2020 (EDT)
:::::::I'm not understanding how information about Stacker will be enhanced on Halopedia by muddying the waters over his being a character in Halo 1 or not. Clearly he is in later games. It's not terribly harmful to consider him a character in Halo 1. It was clearly Bungie's intent with making the action figure him specifically rather than a generic nameless marine. To me, it would make things more confusing leaving him out of it. I would think just a trivia note saying something about how the marine bodies, heads, and voices could be swapped around would let readers know that Halo 1 was not as forward-planned as subsequent games because the popularity of Halo was a complete unknown at the time. -[[User:ScaleMaster117|ScaleMaster117]] ([[User talk:ScaleMaster117|talk]]) 10:30, March 29, 2020 (EDT)
::::::::Apologies for the late reponse. I'd completely forgotten about this vote, until topic came up yet again on the Discord today, which reminded me. My thoughts are, given all the evidence shown, that Bungie's intent is clear; the Marine Sergeant in CE is meant to be Stacker. However, I still remain unconvinced that nowadays, 343 would consider that to be the case in a canonical sense. Consequently, I would personally favour moving the info about his CE appearance to the production notes section. {{User:Dab1001/Sig2}} 10:09, April 17, 2020 (EDT)