Editing Talk:Covenant languages

== Translated Sangheili dictionary? ==

Go here to dowload it: [http://www.mediafire.com/?81wlb1bdx0w3mac http://www.mediafire.com/?81wlb1bdx0w3mac]

I found this on the ''interwebz''. It's supposedly a dictionary with  many Sangheili words and phrases translated into English. I'm not currently aware of it's source an it is most likely conjecture. But I still felt it might have some form of validity and be worth sharing. So what do you think of it?--[[User:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:red">Brute Honour Guard</span>]] [[Image:HGBrute.jpg|20px]] ([[User talk:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:orange">"Talk"</span>]]) 00:43, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
:I really don't know what to think about this right now. Most likely it is fake. I just don't know.--[[User:Halofan1234|ハローファン]] ([[User talk:Halofan1234|H1234-NET]]) 00:47, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
::It appears to be fan made. No sources are cited, ie; Combat Evolved, Reach, Ghosts of Onyx which all have true Sanghelian spoken but without any translation - where for example do they come up with "Jinohag" meaning "to wear", or "Gro'gragort" meaning "enemy"? If indications are to be believed, Sanghelian is modelled on Forerunner, which was an entirely contextual language - one word may mean dozens of things depending on what precedes it or comes after, placement in the sentence, modifiers, etc. It looks like a cool glossary, and I'd definitely recommend it for fanon works, but it's definitely not canon.-- [[User:Specops306|<b><font color=indigo>Specops306</font></b>]] [[w:c:halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>Qur'a 'Morhek</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:31, 2 August 2011 (EDT)

== Sangheili language? ==

Came across this tidbit on a Reddit r/halo [http://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/117i35/a_terminal_video_from_halo4_uncovers_secret/ post]: ''"Bungie said in one of their podcasts that they were working with some people at a language college to develop a language for them. Of course there's the occasional English, but for the most part they spoke their own language."'' It seems to be used in this [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPYHq1Zv8lM Halo 4 terminal video]. So perhaps the Sangheili will have a proper conlang, at least! [[User talk:Neme &#39;Zusatee|Neme &#39;Zusatee]] 21:23, 9 October 2012 (EDT)

:Attempts are being made to get some translations here:https://forums.halowaypoint.com/yaf_postst128404_Finding-out-the-Elite-Language.aspx
:Also, I notice a lot of the words from glasslands are noted on the page. http://img810.imageshack.us/img810/9315/signxb.jpg 22:31, 7 November 2012 (EST)

Heiro does not mean hand. Possession is formed in the following way:
Possessor+small pause+possessed noun
Requiem+small pause+qano=Requiem's treasures.
I have yet to see a verb ending in -a
Intiuko=Indaiuk=Indaiuk'sho=brother/friend/loyal friend. Why is this word pronounced differently every time?
Tashi=they/different/refers to third group which the speaker is not part of.
ku- creates comparative/increases meaning kutashi=very different(=>alien=>human). kuyaha=faster.
Regatshito= find [imperative]
Wo=way (wort=go[imperative])
Noko=keep away [imperative]
mœio/meio/møo=us/ours/refers to a group that the speaker is part of. Why does the pronunciation change again?
Gei=raiding party/parties [probably]
tanieshu=have returned[probably]
rue=ships
ru'e=boarding parties
Nou=no[inside a sentence]
Hei=no[no and in a sentence]
imauga=for a time/temporarily/refers to a short something that will last only for a short period of time
Watanishi=prepare [imperative]
roke'e=rise[verb,imperative]
se=from
Pe=of
Neru=Servant/servants
'Odosima=abiding Truth
Malurok=Decided Heart
Jishiua=hand
Utshans/Utshãns/Otshoka=Shipmaster
Domo'Ingænen=human
koyakumo=vector
magatshi=approach[noun]
ezan=inside
Jine=soul

I can be more accurate if I use the International Phonetic Alphabet. There is no clue that Sangheili have imperative but I posted it for info to bemore aaccurate in case they have one. The change of pronunciation in some words can be justified by the fact that the Sangheili in Halo 4 are from different regions in different worlds. Like Jul and Get for instance. All non English characters are there todenote non eEnglish sounds. Also t has almost always a click before it. q and k denote different sounds. The English alphabet is inadequate to describe Sangheili phonology because most of their sounds do not exist in English/or can only be clearly expressed via the IPA.{{Unsigned|The Master Builder}}

== Translations of Sangheili Language's Species Names ==

I'm not sure those really work. Yes, they call the worm-creatures "lekgolo" and in English we call them "Hunters," but "Hunters" is a descriptive nickname humans assigned to that species, probably before we ever heard the word "lekgolo." Even then it's only about a specific 'form' of lekgolo (and it's rather arbitrary IMO, since they don't seem to do much hunting). I very much doubt that if a sangheili was to talk about someone being a great hunter that to our ears it'd sound like "[something something] lekgolo." Do you get what I mean, that "Hunter" isn't translated from the meaning of the word "lekgolo?" For all we know the actual word "lekgolo" literally translates to something like "ground's worm-gems" but would more likely be translated as "valuable/costly earthworms."

That's not to say that that stuff shouldn't be included at all, because they ''are'' translations, but not in the same way as the others and that should be noted.

As a separate issue, do we even know that they're all sangheili words? I very much doubt that the san 'shyuum would go by/adopt the sangheili name for their species when they're theoretically partners (especially when they're ''actually'' superiors). Unggoy, huragok, lekgolo and sangheili all have specific references from Ghosts of Onyx on their individual pages, saying "the sangheili name for ''X''." The other names just come from the manuals or whatever and, AFAIK, we have no way of knowing if it's their native names for themselves or if they're sangheili designations. To be honest, I can only really accept the Drones using a Sangheili Language-derived name, the rest being too independent in their own ways. --[[Special:Contributions/86.29.7.17|86.29.7.17]] 22:04, 26 May 2014 (EDT)

== San'Shyuum Language ==

It appears that Regret's speech in Halo 2 Anniversary is now said in Sangeili. I am saying that because I recognised the word kabono and the languages' structure reminds that of Sangheili as it would be spoken by an alien. But where exactly was it ever stated that the monk chant we heard in the Original halo 2 was the San'Shyuum language?
:Are you sure? Because based on what they've said so far they weren't supposed to be re-recording any dialog (if that's the case you could check it flipping the graphics-audio switch and see if the original is any different). It's also possible it's a coincidence, or 343i fashioned some parts of their Sangheili language after Regret's speech/Bungie's script for it. --[[User:Jugus|<font color="MidnightBlue"><b>Jugus</b></font>]] <small>([[User talk:Jugus|<font color="Gray">Talk</font>]] | [[Special:Contributions/Jugus|<font color="Gray">Contribs</font>]])</small> 06:48, 12 November 2014 (EST)

::Regret's speech was always in another language. As Jugus said, it's possible 343 took the original into account when they created the Sangheili language. In which case, it's not unusual for words and grammar to transfer from one language to another through cultural contact - modern English is a hodgepodge of Celtic, Anglo-Saxon Germanic, Latin, Old Norse, Norman French, and various influences from its colonial days. Given the three millenia-long cultural contact between the Elites and Prophets, I'd be stunned if it didn't happen, or if they didn't do away with separate languages altogether and fashion a hybrid language they both used as the elite castes. -- [[User:Morhek|<b><font color=indigo>Qura 'Morhek</font></b>]] [[w:c:halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>The Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>of Morheka</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:05, 13 November 2014 (EST)
@@ Line 3: / Line 3: @@
 Go here to dowload it: [http://www.mediafire.com/?81wlb1bdx0w3mac http://www.mediafire.com/?81wlb1bdx0w3mac]
-I found this on the ''interwebz''. It's supposedly a dictionary with  many Sangheili words and phrases translated into English. I'm not currently aware of it's source an it is most likely conjecture. But I still felt it might have some form of validity and be worth sharing. So what do you think of it?--[[User:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:red">Brute Honour Guard</span>]] File:HGBrute.jpg|20px]] ([[User talk:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:orange">"Talk"</span>]]) 00:43, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
+I found this on the ''interwebz''. It's supposedly a dictionary with  many Sangheili words and phrases translated into English. I'm not currently aware of it's source an it is most likely conjecture. But I still felt it might have some form of validity and be worth sharing. So what do you think of it?--[[User:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:red">Brute Honour Guard</span>]] [[Image:HGBrute.jpg|20px]] ([[User talk:Brute Honour Guard|<span style="color:orange">"Talk"</span>]]) 00:43, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
 :I really don't know what to think about this right now. Most likely it is fake. I just don't know.--[[User:Halofan1234|ハローファン]] ([[User talk:Halofan1234|H1234-NET]]) 00:47, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
-::It appears to be fan made. No sources are cited, ie; Combat Evolved, Reach, Ghosts of Onyx which all have true Sanghelian spoken but without any translation - where for example do they come up with "Jinohag" meaning "to wear", or "Gro'gragort" meaning "enemy"? If indications are to be believed, Sanghelian is modelled on Forerunner, which was an entirely contextual language - one word may mean dozens of things depending on what precedes it or comes after, placement in the sentence, modifiers, etc. It looks like a cool glossary, and I'd definitely recommend it for fanon works, but it's definitely not canon.-- [[User:Specops306|<b><font color=indigo>Specops306</font></b>]] [[halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>Qur'a 'Morhek</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:31, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
+::It appears to be fan made. No sources are cited, ie; Combat Evolved, Reach, Ghosts of Onyx which all have true Sanghelian spoken but without any translation - where for example do they come up with "Jinohag" meaning "to wear", or "Gro'gragort" meaning "enemy"? If indications are to be believed, Sanghelian is modelled on Forerunner, which was an entirely contextual language - one word may mean dozens of things depending on what precedes it or comes after, placement in the sentence, modifiers, etc. It looks like a cool glossary, and I'd definitely recommend it for fanon works, but it's definitely not canon.-- [[User:Specops306|<b><font color=indigo>Specops306</font></b>]] [[w:c:halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>Qur'a 'Morhek</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:31, 2 August 2011 (EDT)
 == Sangheili language? ==
@@ Line 62: / Line 62: @@
 :Are you sure? Because based on what they've said so far they weren't supposed to be re-recording any dialog (if that's the case you could check it flipping the graphics-audio switch and see if the original is any different). It's also possible it's a coincidence, or 343i fashioned some parts of their Sangheili language after Regret's speech/Bungie's script for it. --[[User:Jugus|<font color="MidnightBlue"><b>Jugus</b></font>]] <small>([[User talk:Jugus|<font color="Gray">Talk</font>]] | [[Special:Contributions/Jugus|<font color="Gray">Contribs</font>]])</small> 06:48, 12 November 2014 (EST)
-::Regret's speech was always in another language. As Jugus said, it's possible 343 took the original into account when they created the Sangheili language. In which case, it's not unusual for words and grammar to transfer from one language to another through cultural contact - modern English is a hodgepodge of Celtic, Anglo-Saxon Germanic, Latin, Old Norse, Norman French, and various influences from its colonial days. Given the three millenia-long cultural contact between the Elites and Prophets, I'd be stunned if it didn't happen, or if they didn't do away with separate languages altogether and fashion a hybrid language they both used as the elite castes. -- [[User:Morhek|<b><font color=indigo>Qura 'Morhek</font></b>]] [[halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>The Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>of Morheka</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:05, 13 November 2014 (EST)
+::Regret's speech was always in another language. As Jugus said, it's possible 343 took the original into account when they created the Sangheili language. In which case, it's not unusual for words and grammar to transfer from one language to another through cultural contact - modern English is a hodgepodge of Celtic, Anglo-Saxon Germanic, Latin, Old Norse, Norman French, and various influences from its colonial days. Given the three millenia-long cultural contact between the Elites and Prophets, I'd be stunned if it didn't happen, or if they didn't do away with separate languages altogether and fashion a hybrid language they both used as the elite castes. -- [[User:Morhek|<b><font color=indigo>Qura 'Morhek</font></b>]] [[w:c:halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>The Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>of Morheka</sup></font></i></u>]] 03:05, 13 November 2014 (EST)
-== Split and info move ==
-I've found that the "Language" subsection on most species' articles sufficiently covers its respective species' languages better than this page. I propose for this page to be divided into four pages: "Sangheili (language)", "Kig-Yar language", "San'Shyuum language", and "Yonhetian". Most of the information that covers the Covenant's ''lingua franca'' can be moved under "Sangheili (language)". The reason I believe the four aforementioned languages get their own articles is because they either have canonical names, known words in the languages (or gestures, in the case of the San'Shyuum), or have sufficient information to have their own articles. The rest of the information on this page can be moved to the "Language" subsection on its respective species' articles, if it isn't already their. Any thoughts? - [[User:NightHammer|NightHammer]] ([[User talk:NightHammer|talk]]) 17:28, 13 June 2015 (EDT)
-:I would argue that the Huragok language is also worth including as a separate page, since they're the in-universe language we've had the most exposure to after Sangheili and Kig-Yar. -- [[User:Morhek|<b><font color=indigo>Qura 'Morhek</font></b>]] [[halofanon:user:Specops306|<u><i><font color=blue><sup>The Autocrat</sup></font></i></u>]] [[User talk:Specops306|<u><i><font color=purple><sup>of Morheka</sup></font></i></u>]] 00:15, 14 June 2015 (EDT)
-::That could work. I forgot that ''Broken Circle'' went into more detail with Huragok sign language. - [[User:NightHammer|NightHammer]] ([[User talk:NightHammer|talk]]) 00:19, 14 June 2015 (EDT)
-:I agree too, now that the Covenant is disbanded and the individual languages are getting more detail. [[User:Tuckerscreator|<span style="color:#6600cc;">'''''Tuckerscreator'''''</span>]]<sup>([[User talk:Tuckerscreator|<font color="#008000">stalk</font>]])</sup> 00:54, 14 June 2015 (EDT)
-::All right, if no one disagrees, I will start working on it now. - [[User:NightHammer|NightHammer]] ([[User talk:NightHammer|talk]]) 08:36, 14 June 2015 (EDT)